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80sography - 80s music interviews podcast, s02e06 (20.01.2021): Nicky Holland: I think that 'Famous [Last Words]' is just, in some ways, it's quite simple. And the whole Tom Waits bit and asking him to sing it, I'm not quite sure I remember about that. All I remember was that I'd mentioned Tom Waits because of what I've been listening to. And I don't know whether then I played Roland some of it or what. I can't remember... and maybe they did ask him, I can't remember, but I don't know why Roland would have really wanted anyone else to sing it. <...> H: Then Dave Bascombe mentioned that David of Was (Not Was), did a version of it as well. Nicky Holland: I'm really curious as to know why Roland didn't just sing it or why he felt he couldn't sing it, or why he shouldn't sing it, or why shouldn't Curt sing it. And I don't know. H: So you don't know if actually Curt had a go, because I always felt like he could have done the quiet verses and then Roland could have come in with the epic bit at the end. Nicky Holland: In the middle, yeah. But then they would have been the couple. [laughs] H: [laughs] Oh, the tabloids would love that, wouldn't they? Nicky Holland: They would have loved it, yeah. H: This is the... Okay, I'm going to rethink that, actually, as an idea. Nicky Holland: [laughs] H: Would have been the couple. Nicky Holland: [laughs] H: And then listening to the band that made them cry, which is Tears For Fears, right? Nicky Holland: 'Listening to the band that made us cry'. H: And what a perfect way out. Nicky Holland: 'To stay in this real life situation for one last refrain'.

'Naked Lunch' podcast (09.05.2024): H: I actually met Roland briefly when you were apart, like at some like album release party. CS: Right. H: And it's fascinating because I, again, knowing Hall & Oates, it's like the tensions that can exist make artists overlook the most obvious thing, which is from Lennon and McCartney, Bacharach/David, when there are people who, artists who, when they blend have something that neither can do on their own. CS: Without question. H: And literally vocally, like the insanity of the Tears for Fears was like... Roland is extremely talented. It's fascinating. And a lot of, I think, when I think of some of the torment of that is at the heart of some of the art, I think that's so much him. I will say that it is as a music critic, I'll put my music critic hat on. It's insane to think that you could, the two voices, literally the blending of the two voices like Lennon and McCartney. It's like you don't get 'A Day In the Life' if you don't have those two people, and you don't, like when... so he had one song during the time you were not in the group. He put out, I think two albums, studio albums. CS: Yeah. H: There's one I really liked called 'Break It Down Again'. CS: Which we play! H: I think you guys still do it. CS: And I, and I like that song too. H: But when I listened to it, because it's the only song without you I listened to when I was getting ready to come over here, I was thinking like, 'I like it because he recreated you'. CS: Me singing that one bit. H: Exactly! I said, 'Oh my God! There's that bit!' CS: Which live I sing! H: Yes, but it wasn't you. CS: No. H: And that must have been, I don't know if that's a little annoying... H2: They got a sound alike? H: Well... CS: No, he just impersonates my voice effectively, you know. Yeah, I mean, what's interesting when you're talking about, you know, things like duos like that and the friction is what creates it or, you know, when someone asked me to explain, you know, where does the Tears for Fears sound come from, it's the stuff we can agree on. That's it. It's as simple as that. If I hate it, we don't do it. If he hates it, we don't do it. If we can both agree on it, we'll do it. So it's the balance, it's that bit in the middle where we meet that creates something that we now, in our dotage, uh, we now appreciate. You know we, we appreciate it more now than we ever did growing up. H: So was it that rule that we've learned through other duos that... H2: We actually have... H: ...the most passionate wins. H2: ...either positively or negatively will win. CS: Wins. Yeah, generally that's true. Yeah. H: That's the only way to a true partnership right? CS: Yeah, um, yeah, I mean, as you get older, I think, it's more... You realise it's more compromise than anything, 'cause we're way past the sort of 'Who wants to be the alpha dog?' phase. We're way past that. We've now got to the phase, which I'm very grateful for, making 'The Tipping Point' album. And it really happened during this album, for the first time, I think, really, where we really had an appreciation of what we both bring to it. H: Yeah, CS: And appreciated each other. And, um, it's taken us till we're 60 years old to get there, but what the hey! H: Listen, as long as you end up there it really doesn't matter! CS: Yeah.