#statelessness

My issue with it, is actually the war on Palestine

(I'm trying my best to explain the issue but it's not gonna be perfect, so please please please read the links below)

Some countries already do not have birthright citizenship, the citizenship of babies born in that country depends on the citizenship of their parents.

The problem is Palestine isn't considered a full legal country by all countries.

So if Palestinians flee the war as refugees, they may end up in a country that doesn't have birthright citizenship. Because it's really really really hard (impossible) to enact Palestinian nationality laws. Because much of Palestine is under occupation of Israel.

Which makes the baby (and sometimes the parents) stateless.

Statelessness is a HUGE ISSUE for discrimination. Because they don't have any valid documents proving their origin. They have no nationality. They have no country to protect them. They have no country to be deported to (or they risk being deported to a country that's actively hostile against them).

If an American travels and gets captured by a terrorist organization, their government will protect their citizen. Stateless people have no such protection. Moreover, trying to get jobs, visas, travel documents with no nationality is a shitload of red tape.

So, yeah. Birthright citizenship isn't just about protecting people from being deported to a country they don't know. It's about protecting people from being stateless.

Because if refugees flee to the United States and they're here for.. 10 years? 15? They're probably gonna have children. And those children will be full legal citizens of the United States, and not have to deal with the hurdles of atatelessness that their parents have to fight just to go to school or get a job.

Pocharapon Neammanee at HuffPost:

A Palestinian woman released from Immigration and Customs Enforcement detention on Tuesday says she and others faced mistreatment while detained. Still, the Department of Homeland Security dismissed her account as one of many “sob stories.” “The entire detention process was not great. I wouldn’t wish this upon anybody. It was very hard, very traumatizing, and very, very difficult, is what I would say,” Ward Sakeik told CNN’s Danny Freeman on Saturday morning. Sakeik, 22, a stateless person whose family is from Gaza, was born in Saudi Arabia, a country that does not grant birthright citizenship to children of foreign-born parents, according to The Guardian. She entered the U.S. legally under a tourist visa when she was 8 and was allowed to remain, as long as she regularly checked in with ICE.

After getting married, she began the process of obtaining a green card, but was taken by ICE officials in February on her way back to Texas from her honeymoon in the Virgin Islands, a U.S. territory. DHS Assistant Secretary Tricia McLaughlin told CNN that Sakeik’s arrest was not part of a targeted operation by ICE, but that she was flagged by Customs and Border Patrol trying to reenter the U.S. after flying over international waters. In a statement shared with HuffPost, McLaughlin said Sakeik was not “complying with immigration policies.” “The facts are she is in our country illegally,” McLaughlin said. “She overstayed her visa and has had a final order by an immigration judge for over a decade.”

Sakeik was released Tuesday and appeared at a press conference where she talked about her experience, saying she was handcuffed for 16 hours without any water or food on a bus.

The classless DHS dismissed the treatment of the stateless Ward Sakeik while in detention as a “sob story.”

See Also:

a deep dive into the nightmare of having no country

most Americans can't imagine being stateless. let me explain what Trump's order would actually create by looking at stateless people worldwide.

THE CURRENT GLOBAL CRISIS

Right now, worldwide:

12 million+ people are stateless

1 in 3 are children

Every 10 minutes, a child is born stateless

Most common in: Syria, Bangladesh, Myanmar, Thailand

WHAT STATELESSNESS MEANS PRACTICALLY

You cannot:

✗ Get a passport

✗ Open a bank account

✗ Get legally married

✗ Register your children's births

✗ Get a driver's license

✗ Access healthcare (non-emergency)

✗ Enroll in higher education

✗ Get a legal job

✗ Own property

✗ Travel legally

✗ Vote

✗ Access courts for protection

You basically don't exist as a legal person.

THE BIDOON OF KUWAIT

Perfect example of generational statelessness:

100,000+ people in Kuwait

Lived there for generations

When Kuwait became independent (1961), they didn't register

Now their grandchildren are still stateless

Can't work legally, marry legally, or leave

Exist in permanent limbo

This is what Trump wants to create in America.

THE ROHINGYA MODEL

Myanmar stripped citizenship from Rohingya people:

Said they were "actually Bangladeshi"

Bangladesh said "no they're not"

Result: 1+ million stateless people

Led to genocide and mass exile

Still stateless in refugee camps

Sound familiar? "They're not really American..."

DOMINICAN REPUBLIC / HAITI SITUATION

In 2013, Dominican Republic ruled:

Children of undocumented Haitians aren't citizens

Retroactive to 1929

200,000+ people suddenly stateless

Four generations lost citizenship overnight

International condemnation, still unchanged

Trump's order = same thing, bigger scale.

THE DAILY REALITY FOR STATELESS KIDS

Based on UNHCR documentation:

Maria, 8, stateless in Netherlands:

Can't go on school trips (no travel docs)

Can't join sports teams (need ID)

Friends don't understand why she's "different"

Parents can't explain what she did wrong

Depression and anxiety from age 6

Ahmed, 16, stateless in Germany:

Accepted to university

Can't enroll without citizenship docs

Can't get student visa anywhere else

Works illegally in restaurant

Brilliant kid, wasted potential

THE HEALTHCARE NIGHTMARE

Stateless people in "developed" countries:

Emergency care only

No insurance possible

Chronic conditions untreated

Mental health ignored

Pregnant women get minimal prenatal care

Higher infant mortality rates

In America, this means:

ER visits only

No Medicaid

No CHIP

No preventive care

Medical debt with no recourse

THE EDUCATION TRAP

Even where primary education is allowed:

No official transcripts

Can't take standardized tests

No college applications

No financial aid

No study abroad

No professional licenses

Imagine being valedictorian but unable to go to college.

THE PERPETUAL CHILDHOOD

Stateless adults remain legal children:

Can't sign contracts

Can't consent to medical treatment

Can't get married legally

Can't be legal parents to their own kids

Permanent dependence

THE MENTAL HEALTH IMPACT

Studies on stateless populations show:

78% develop depression

65% have anxiety disorders

45% have PTSD symptoms

30% attempt suicide

Children show developmental delays

Being told you don't belong anywhere breaks people.

THE CRIME VULNERABILITY

Stateless people:

Can't report crimes (fear deportation to nowhere)

Targeted by traffickers

Exploited by employers

No legal recourse

Often forced into illegal work

Then criminalized for surviving

THE GENERATIONAL CURSE

Children of stateless parents often:

Inherit statelessness

Can't be registered at birth

Grow up "illegal"

Repeat the cycle

Create permanent underclass

In 50 years: Millions of American-born non-Americans?

THE DETENTION LIMBO

When stateless people are detained:

Can't be deported (nowhere to go)

Can't be released (no status)

Indefinite detention common

Some detained for DECADES

Legal black hole

THE ECONOMIC COST

Countries with large stateless populations lose:

Tax revenue (can't work legally)

Economic productivity

Healthcare costs increase

Education investments wasted

Social instability

International reputation

THE U.S. SPECIFIC HORRORS

Under Trump's order, American-born stateless would face:

No Social Security number

No state ID

Can't get Real ID

Can't fly domestically

Can't enter federal buildings

Can't get background checks

Permanently unemployable legally

THE INTERNATIONAL LAW VIOLATION

UN Convention on Statelessness (1961):

Prohibits creating stateless children

Requires citizenship for those born in territory

US never signed but claims to follow principles

This order violates every principle

THE SIMILAR SITUATIONS

Countries that tried this:

Dominican Republic: International pariah

Myanmar: Accused of genocide

Syria: Kurds left stateless, led to instability

Nepal: Reversed after international pressure

America joining this list?

THE "PAPERS PLEASE" SOCIETY

Every American child would need to prove:

Parents' status at birth

Both parents' documentation

Hospital verification

Government database check

One missing document = not American

THE REAL STORIES COMING

If this happens, expect:

Suicides of stateless teens

Families torn apart

Brilliant kids wasted

Communities destabilized

International condemnation

Generational trauma

THE UNIQUELY AMERICAN TWIST

Unlike other countries, US stateless would:

Speak only English

Know only American culture

Have no other homeland connection

Be told they're not American

Have nowhere else to claim them

True ghosts in their birthplace.

THE BOTTOM LINE

Statelessness is:

Psychological torture

Economic death sentence

Social erasure

Generational curse

Human rights violation

Trump wants to create potentially millions of these ghost people.

In America.

Starting with babies.

This isn't policy. It's cruelty.

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Hey so this is happening and it's bad. Palestine is not recognized as a state by much of the world, so this risks making these children stateless.

Belgium saying it has nothing to do with the current round of conflict doesn't mean a damn thing. It's not like Israel hasn't been bombing the shit out of Gaza before August. What sets off alarm bells for me is this:

[The spokesperson] said that the Belgian authorities remain concerned about potential "abuses" of the country's asylum system. "The Foreigners' Office regularly notes that Palestinians in the European Union go to Belgium to have children there in order to acquire Belgian citizenship and, consequently, to benefit from family reunification," he said. "[We will] fight against practices where people who do not have the right to do so try to possess Belgian nationality," he added.

I trust this anti-immigrant rhetoric is familiar to Americans and others. Oh no, they get to have kids outside of a war zone, get citizenship in the EU, and keep their families together. What an awful thing to help enable.

By definition, people who apply for asylum are in a bad spot. Certainly it is one way people will try to game the system, but people will attempt to exploit any advantage they think they have, especially if it gets them out of very real danger.

I don't know anything about how asylum in the EU/Belgium works or if the Foreigners' Office can even do this, but it is deeply concerning they think they might have the authority to do something that drastic. Denaturalization of groups (usually ethnic minorities) is closely associated with ethnic cleansing and genocide.

It's important to understand that making someone stateless basically strips them of their rights. The "human rights" we have in our society are basically dependent on being a citizen of a state willing to provide for those rights. By making someone stateless, they are effectively deprived of the ability to access healthcare, education or work- i.e. their options for survival become very limited.

In effect, what has happened in this case is that the UK government have said if you do something they can persuade people is abhorrent enough, they can strip you of your citizenship and your rights.

It sets a precedent which is deeply, deeply uncomfortable.

A lot of the arguments I've seen around this case point to the fact she was a 15 year old girl, point to the racism involved, but I don't think that's the key issue. I think the key issue is that governments should never be allowed to make people stateless, ever.

“The right to belong” from New York Review of Books