Something actually wrong with him

SeeBS

Here, I am going to dissect @the-real-seebs ’s last answer to one of my asks, which I will stick here:

The only credible evidence of "ABA abuse" any of you can come up with, and the only case I have EVER seen of electric shocks being used in the last several decades, is the JRC. Which is not even an ABA facility, though it uses behaviorism-based techniques. They're for actively dangerous patients as a last resort, and while we might disagree on the ethics of their methods, using it as an evidence of ABA being bad is incredibly disingenuous. ABA therapy DOES NOT USE NEGATIVE REINFORCEMENT.

So let’s get started!

Okay, so, I really clearly and unambiguously said “do not try to argue this with me on anon”. Here you are.

Yes. It turns out I cannot stand misinformation on something that is literally saving lives. How interesting.

You want to see the abuse? You’re being abusive, right here, right now. That this ask was sent tells me, with no potential for doubt or inaccuracy or guesswork, that you are willing to behave in 100% unambiguously abusive ways. You know that you were asked not to do this, and yet, here you are.

This is a common pattern I have observed in seebs. “You’re being abusive” allows him to shut down all discussion, and sometimes, as he actually did for one of my earlier asks, he adds some sexual connotation to it. The reason is simple: seebs surrounds himself with abuse victims, especially CSA. I am not entirely sure why, but I’ll be honest, I am vaguely suspecting easy channels for emotional manipulation. This is in extremely bad faith, though.

You. Are. Abusive. Right here, right now. You are engaging in behavior which violates a clearly stated boundary, where there is no justification for violating that boundary. It would require minimal effort to follow the stated boundary, and you won’t.

Your initial boundary was, in fact, “Go away”. This is the first time you mention going off anon as a possibility, and I explicitly said I would. Anyway, fuck that. Ignoring a boundary that has been clearly stated in bad faith? Is not only something that’s not abusive, but something you. Have. Done. And anyway, “stating boundaries” in order to silence a conversation is abusive. No matter how you word it.

Furthermore, you make a number of false claims.

And I would love to be proven wrong! Listen, if it suddenly turns out, against everything I’ve ever actually learned, that ABA is inherently abusive, and violent, and gives kids PTSD systematically, and cannot ever possibly be used well? I’ll drop all my plans for going into it. Because I’m not a fucking sociopath.

I have pointed out other examples of abusive behavior in the past, as have many other people. The electric shock example stands out because it’s on one of the clearly-defined lists of “things we know are fucked up” that you don’t have to walk people through to get them to understand a thing.

Could you point me to those other examples? I don’t seem to find them in your previous answers. Anyway, we know these things are fucked up because someone did them at some point in the past. I’ll outright say it: while Løvaas didn’t know what he was doing was wrong, it absolutely was.

But notice how that was decades ago. ABA started with Løvaas, but it absolutely didn’t stop evolving once he was gone. Claiming otherwise is about as stupid as saying brain surgeons are all evil because of lobotomies.

But that doesn’t mean it’s the only credible evidence.

I would, again, love to see the others. No, unfortunately, blog posts don’t count, sorry. You know about as well as I do how often people lie on the Internet, especially when they have an agenda, and we might both know a few of the abusive groups stirring up anti-psychiatry sentiment.

You claim that ABA “does not use negative reinforcement”.

Minor aside here: I am using “negative reinforcement”, not in the actual behaviorist sense (taking away something, e.g. a toy), but in the pop culture sense of “punishment for bad behavior”, as opposed to “rewards for good behavior”. I’m pointing that out because another person attempted to use papers with that word (under the behaviorist definition) for some scare-mongering earlier.

And yet, so many people have been through so many things that were called “ABA” which did, but they don’t count,

I can claim to cure cancer by bleach enemas. Does that mean all oncologists are frauds? ABA being the only evidence-based form of treatment for symptoms of autism spectrum disorders (again, I would love to be proven wrong) means many non-board-certified hacks call their therapy ABA. Which you have admitted yourself. (See all variants of “Sometimes they just call their therapy ABA for insurance purposes but it’s ~*~actually good~*~”, which, yes, is fraud)

because you’re not actually here to argue a point or understand a thing, you’re here to demonstrate your ability to continue applying force to a person who asked you to stop. Because you are the abuser.

I am honestly impressed. It’s probably the antisocial traits, but that is the most amazing mastery of social manipulation I have seen in a person with autism. You know exactly what the demographic of your blog’s viewers is, and you appeal to emotions they, specifically, relate to. “Applying force”, by sending mean anons, of course, “to a person who asked you to stop”: you’re not attempting to argue against me, you’re pushing your sexually abused friends’ buttons.

This sounds ironic, but I am, in fact, impressed.

As I said before: If you want to argue off anon, you’re allowed, and I’d be willing to show you more evidence and actually do some of your research for you.

(Watch him backpedal at this. I bet you’re going to call me even more abusive for going off anon.)

But you aren’t, are you? You even said you could but then decided not to. Why? To show that you have power. To show that you can hurt people who’ve told you to stop.

*sad trombone noises*

For the record: I’m lazy. Making a Tumblr account takes effort. Executive dysfunction is abusive now, incredible.

The problem isn’t that you aren’t aware of ABA tactics that are abusive. The problem is that you are willing to do abusive things, and will never admit that they are abusive,

I’m stealing something from your own rhetorical maneuvering here, but: fun fact, a hallmark of narcissistic behavior is insulting other people by accusing them of something the person does themself.

because you don’t feel like it’s abusive to hurt people to show them that you have the power to hurt them in order to compel them to act.

“Compel them to act”? Sure, I prefer you posting my asks to you blocking me, but it’s at worst an inconvenience, as seen here by the fact that I have this freshly-made Tumblr account.

And this whole post is nothing to you but an affirmation that hurting people to make them give you the responses you wanted is a good tactic that works and since it’s effective no one should call it abuse.

You know, you’re good at that stuff. Because you wanted exactly this out of me, didn’t you? Making me go off anon and interact directly so that you can feel smug and righteou--

And I’m posting this because you will feel smug and righteous and like you proved your point that hurting people and disregarding boundaries works,

*snorts*

and everyone else will say “wow, ABA really is that fucked up”.

Great job with that post! Also at myself, honestly, it was hard to go through in its entirety.

Seebs: huh

The exile au brainrot doesn't stup

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