So I just started a new DA2 playthrough, and remembered something that I'd love to get your thoughts and opinions on, especially since your Joanna romanced Anders. If you give Fenris to Danarius, basically everyone disapproves, except Anders, who actually *approves*. I understand the basics: he's so far gone to his cause he wants everyone who disagrees with him *gone*, fellow ex-slave or no, but I'd love to see if you had a more in-depth thought process on it. Thanks!
Hi. :)
I ... honestly don’t have much in the way of deep thoughts on Anders himself here, because I don’t think Anders is the core problem. I’ve seen people wring their hands over that +5 before, and it’s always confused me. I feel like if you’re worrying about the minutiae of a +5 to friendship you are not grappling with the full horror of what just happened. This whole quest is a catastrophic failure of the friendship/rivalry system.
So - the quest page is here.
Digging a little further tells me that on XBox, at least, Isabela will give a +5 to rivalry for the threat to Fenris’s sister, but nothing for Fenris himself. She has a line, objecting to Hawke’s actions, but no friendship/rivalry change.
I mean - what the hell are we looking at here? Do you know? Because I absolutely do not.
We have a solid +10 rivalry average for handing a friend over to a slaver. I can make that back with two moderately funny purple responses in the right places. In fact, as this is an Act 3 quest I would imagine that many people are missing some or all of these changes because they’ve already maxed out their companions’ scores one way or another. It’s an utter non-event.
Merrill, whose people were enslaved en masse by Tevinter, who lost her whole culture to them and is scrabbling to reclaim it, gives a +10 to rivalry when a fellow elf is handed over to a Tevinter Magister for enslavement and torture. Isabela, the pirate captain who liberates slaves has no followup on that at all. Our biggest rivalry gain is from Aveline, at +15, and - wow. Impressive. A whole 15 rivalry points for doing the worst possible thing to a long-time friend and comrade.
+10! +10! What does it mean? “We can still go for drinks later, but we’re going to sulk”? “Hawke, you’re barred from game night for the next two weeks for that silliness”? I can’t let it go. Those little +10s to rivalry make me much angrier than Anders’s +5 to friendship because they’re treated as sufficient. Anders’s +5 causes distress and dismay, because it worries people that he approves of slavery, but a tiny +10 to rivalry for one of the worst things you can do in this game - and we are not a little bit worried about everyone else’s moral compass?
This isn’t the dealbreaker? This isn’t the day we all leave and never talk to Hawke again? Why the fuck not?
So - for context, in The Urn of Sacred Ashes, back in Origins, Leliana will literally fight you to the death over desecrating the relic; if you spare Loghain in The Landsmeet, Alistair will leave you; if you don’t murder Anders in The Last Straw in retaliation for the death of Grand Cleric Elthina, Sebastian will leave and wage war on Kirkwall. But we can give Fenris to a slaver and it’s fucking fine. Oh, we’re a little annoyed, but we’ll get over it
I am so angry. Not at you, for talking about it, but at the writing in this quest. I don’t think there’s anything very meaningful to be said about Anders specifically. He and Fenris loathe each other. They fight and they poke each other’s sore spots. It seemed like a good idea to someone to give Anders a minor friendship bump if Fenris leaves. When the positions are (broadly speaking) reversed, and Fenris gets to comment on Anders’s fate in The Last Straw he says “He wants to die. Kill him and be done with it”. This is not Fenris having strong opinions about the mage rebellion - although he does have those elsewhere. This is a very broad, facile “fuck that guy”. Obviously the circumstances differ, but in terms of caring about each other’s wellbeing they’re about the same. Fuck that guy. If he’s going away, I’m having a good day.
Was it tacky for Bioware to put that +5 friendship into Alone? Yes. Definitely. But I don’t think it means anything at all about Anders or his view on slavery or his cause, because if I did think that, I’d have to think the other companions’ responses were significant too. I’d have to think that their firm position on this is to wrinkle their collective noses a little and then forget about it. And - I’m just going to do the obvious and gesture emphatically at Isabela’s whole character arc here in refutation of that.
I’m not opposed to evil choices in RPGs. That’s ... kind of how role playing works. But this one is so utterly facile as to be revolting. There are no meaningful consequences for this. And while it is possible to do other revolting things in Dragon Age, things done to companions stand out, because from a narrative perspective they matter. We can say in theory that the deaths of unnamed NPCs are bad and wrong - but it will be the characters we know and love that we mourn over. This isn’t the only bad choice you can make, but it’s a really big one.
For Joanna - this is a non-issue. She’s not going to hand anyone over to a slaver, much less her friend, so (mercifully) I do not have to try to rationalise this nonsense.
For anyone going to because they’ve committed to an evil playthrough? This might be a really good time to bring in “Varric is an unreliable narrator” and head canon yourself some reasonable fallout.
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