#marika

Is it just a title for those chosen to take Marika’s place or do they have a special quality to them?

yes, empyreans do have a special quality to them that goes beyond just a title… they are distinct amongst the demigods because they’ve specifically been chosen as a candidate for godhood in a way that is embedded within their very being!

ranni’s dialogue tells us a LOT about empyreans:

“I was once an Empyrean. Of the demigods, only I, Miquella, and Malenia could claim that title. Each of us was chosen by our own Two Fingers, as a candidate to succeed Queen Marika, to become the new god of the coming age. […] But I would not acquiesce to the Two Fingers. I stole the Rune of Death, slew mine own Empyrean flesh, casting it away. I would not be controlled by that thing.”

empyreanhood is something bestowed specifically by the two fingers, the envoys of the greater will. ranni essentially tells us that being named an empyrean gives the fingers a level of control over her “empyrean flesh” that only separating her soul from her body can free her from. her conflict is that she desires to create her own world order independent from the two fingers’ influence by ascending to godhood on her OWN TERMS!

in marika’s case, her rule over the lands between had been as a representative of the two fingers and of the greater will, and we see how her shattering of the elden ring results in the two fingers crucifying her and sealing her away in the erdtree as punishment. enia quotes the two fingers as saying:

“Marika's trespass demanded a heavy sentence. But even in shackles, she remains a god, and the vision's vessel.”

this being a physical punishment forced upon marika, with ranni’s own fears about the two fingers in mind, makes me feel that control of her body had been wrested from her by the two fingers.

also worth noting, miquella also divests himself of his empyrean flesh on his own road to godhood — though he himself never specifically mentions the two fingers or the greater will, count ymir tells us he is trying to sever himself from his “rotten roots:”

“They were each of them defective. Unhinged, from the start. Marika herself. And the fingers that guided her. And this is what troubles me. No matter our efforts, if the roots are rotten, …then we have little recourse.”

“Ever-young Miquella saw things for what they were. He knew that his bloodline was tainted. His roots mired in madness.”

ymir implies ranni and miquella have had their destiny as empyreans thrust upon them by an entity long corrupted… so in order to make their destiny their own, they have to physically sever that tie to the old system!

malenia is kind of a unique case because she never intends to ascend to godhood herself due to her loyalty to her twin, but her empyreanhood is sort of “hijacked” by the scarlet rot… rather than rotting away, she becomes a vector for the scarlet rot’s proliferation, an avatar of the rot’s divine will (which she attempts to avoid). gowry tells us this:

“She was born an Empyrean, carrying the scarlet rot. An Empyrean... is no mere demigod. […] A new god to forge a new Order. Since Malenia fought Radahn, and the great scarlet flower blossomed in Aeonia, I have dedicated myself to her. And to the resplendence of the Order of Rot. The cycle of decay and rebirth.”

malenia’s “curse” of being physically afflicted with the scarlet rot is more like an opportunity for the scarlet rot to flourish within this empyrean’s new age, should she ascend to godhood. just as gowry says, an empyrean is no mere demigod with a title, they are divinely ordained with the destiny to become the god of a new age, which manifests itself within their physical flesh.

it should also be said that the most recent generation of empyreans — malenia, miquella, and ranni — are the ones given the title to succeed queen marika; however, the title of empyrean has been around longer than this generation! the gloam eyed queen is also called an empyrean… we know very little about the time she was active, but she could have been part of marika’s generation of empyreans and vied for dominance at the same time, with marika ultimately defeating her. I wonder if she would have ascended to godhood if she had won, despite her faction dedicated to skinning gods??

I think the duality of this character is so interesting. On a surface level, he's probably somewhat of a neglectful father. He loves his children, but he loves his Order more. The first time Miquella offers him a gift, a discus of light, he feels a flicker of pride, ruffles his hair, and then continues with his crusades. Everything else is merely a quiet chord lost amongst the symphony of his love for The Golden Order.

Marika he loves dearly as well. His other half. The extension of his very being. He loves her golden hair and eyes of gold, he'd spend hours admiring the light catching on her lashes. Memorizing the feel of her shoulder beneath his palm.

And yet he'd notice her pulling away as time went on, lost in the depths of her mind. He worried at first, thinking about Renalla. Perhaps he was cursed, just as his children, to always watch his loved ones crumble around him or because of him. He takes to the Golden Order even harder. The grace of gold will solve this. There will be a reason for all of this suffering. All the while, he doesn't notice Miquella pulling away, and he chooses to ignore the slow rot of Malenia's body. He does not think of Mohg or Morgott once. When his firstborn dies, something in him dies with them. Marika feels the grief even greater. He remains unshaken in his faith, however.

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Which ofc makes sense - because one of the Black Flame incants mentions that the Gloam Eyed Queen was an Empyrean too. I’m thinking maybe they were candidates at the same time and were competing for Godhood in the same manner that Miquella/Ranni are (Malenia having given herself as Miquellas blade rather than try to be a God herself despite having the most potential of the three)

Partly this comes from the Black Flame Monk Amon spirit ashes, that seem to state he ran away from the Fire itself to embrace the Black Flame. Which to me makes it seem that the Gloam-Eyed Queen was still around at the time Marika began her Conquest of the Fire Giants alongside Godfrey and challenged the Fell God (ultimately slaying it according to some Fire Giant incantations). We also know that Maliketh challenged and bested the Gloam-Eyed Queen and her Apostles in Marikas stead.