Vane's interactions with Cagliostro have him bringing her some of Lancelot/Percy's hair for an experiment, only to then ask her what she's planning to do with it. Buddy. Why didn't you ask that before fetching those. Also how did you even get their hair.
HELP
oh Vane please you need to ask first, not after
kinda living up to his dog nickname to fetch something before thinking about the implications
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I'm legit shocked that I actually predicted that the manga timeline was gonna be the one explaining how Shintaro got Retaining Eyes lmao
YeahâŚbut with that, it means this whole âManga Route 2â is a 50 chapters worth of flashbacks with flashbacks right after everyone died in Manga Route 1 (how did yaki!Ayano retain other flashbacks from Seto, Kano, Haruka and Takane).
That and it also possibly mean this Route is the 1st Route (or at least one of the first Routes) because Shintaro got his Retaining Eyes since âbefore he was even bornâ (Mekakucity Actors, Episode 11), or to speak, before he was born in the future Routes, aka all Routes after this âManga Route 2â
It coooooould be more accurate to say Shintaro was always like this in âManga Route 2âł (if this one of the Routes before the 1st Route and that he went on with his life like this) buuuuuuuut then getting the Retaining Eyes, the following Routes made him remembered too many things and got depressed over trying to retain memories of Ayano, so he became xx!Shintaro before becoming the Shintaro we all know again.
That and as a bonus, I donât think we ever got to see Shintaro being smart or mention anything about how he did at school. Just know he thinks friends sucks (was he ever smart though)
Oooo I remember that I asked you once about The Ancient Magus' Bride and you said you were interested in watching the anime. What did you think of it?
AH! Yes Iâve finished The Ancient Magus bride by now! :D
I liked it quite a bit, yes! :D I enjoyed watching it a lot and I REALLY like the character of Elias. But more than that what I liked the most about the show which I was NOT expecting is its strong focus on the importance of existing. Both for yourself and for other people.
The entire show is, essentially, about a person battling with the idea of suicide and the worth of existence, as well as concepts of death and life. All of which I found extremely moving. It was not something I had expected of the series at all and I liked it a LOT.
I was also really really REALLY happy with the attention the series gave to like... accurately portraying Faeries. Something which is VERY important to me. The show took a lot of care in really making sure it captured how faeries tend to operate as well as their own unique grasp of âmoralsâ. And how Faeries can be very strong allies but even when they will literally die to protect you, you should never completely trust them. Such as Chiseâs close friends constantly trying to drag her away to the Faerie world. As well as things like Queen Titania and King Oberonâs relationship. Which is equally romantic and passionate but also very aggresive and in constant competition with each other. Things like that which really showed the Mangaka and the show writers really did their research. Something I extra appreciate since Celtic faerie lore is so very far removed from Japanese folklore. I just really appreciate the extra effort into getting details correct.
On top of this I also really liked the characters. Elias is extremely likeable despite is tantrums and problematic nature of wanting to eat his wife. And Chise, despite being very low-key and morose does not come across as boring and flat as Bella Swan did in Twilight for instance.
My only nit picks are the one instance near the middle of the show where Chise recovers from what was shown to be a very serious injury, and she seems to quite literally âshake it offâ which bothered me as it felt rather contrived and dramatic convenience to have Elias react a certain way. Iâm not sure if this situation was better handled in the manga or not. And I felt the main villain of the season was written to be very strong and interesting, but the pay-off at the end of the season felt a little rushed and lacked the gravitas the show had been building up to at that point.
Also there were one or two very small moments where I felt scenes or visuals dragged on too long and I have a suspicion it was to pad the episodeâs time.
However, I did really and sincerely enjoy the show very much!! and I look forward to whenever a second season will be made! :D and I hope the problems the first season had regarding its main villain will not be present in the second season.
I also look forward to seeing Elias and Chiseâs relationship deepen as theyâve managed to at least make a start by this point. And I want to learn more about Eliasâ backstory, as well as have questions answered about Chiseâs parents. I wish the show would have a moment where she truly opened up her lingering fears and sadness regarding her mother to Elias, as a good romantic couple and story would, but I donât know if the show would do such a thing with the tone its going for, or if they will just have Chise deal with her own internal problems herself and âbecome strongerâ for it without the input of her husband. Because the latter tends to happen way more in Anime than I really like. Which would be fine if it were not for the fact that a romance is about building a relationship between two people. And Iâd like to see these characters lean on each other a little more.
I really enjoyed the internal growth of Chise in season 1, but I am hoping Season 2 will build upon this and start focusing on the two characters as a growing relationship, and we donât just have a repeat of season 1 dealing with internal conflict. I enjoyed it very much for season 1, but we need to move forward and I donât want the story to lean back on its strengths and stagnate as a result.
Iâm looking forward to Season 2 where the shaky foundations of the relationship can be strengthened with deeper trust between them as people. As I feel its the direction the story needs to work itself towards.
(also its just me but I really hate the theme songs haha ;v; )
but yeah. tl;dr I really liked it a lot and want more.
Your Soriel post reminded me of a thought I had. I don't think Sans was being serious with the whole "you'd be dead where you stand" thing because when he judges Frisk he presents you with the choice of killing Asgore and leaving or letting him take their soul and destroy humanity, Sans says that he believes they can do "the right thing" which makes me think he didn't approve of either of the options from the start. Would make sense for the guy who judges you for killing to be a pacifist himself
From this. This is such a fun topic - thank you so much for responding with these cool thoughts!
I find Sansâ post as judge a fascinating and somewhat enigmatic role. In truth, I feel as though him being a judge is, in many ways, rather ill defined. We only see Sans in this one instance acting as a judge over Frisk, and the best we can do to understand this situation is to look at what Sans does here across various timelines. To me I feel as though Sansâ dialogue in the judge role, combined with similar comments he makes elsewhere in the game, do not suggest he is a pacifist so much as they suggest he believes thereâs no point stopping Frisk.
Evidence Sans believes thereâs no point stopping Frisk can be found in his comments about giving up and in his comments about alternate timelines (SAVE, RESET, etc.). In short:
Sans talks about giving up several times. He even talks about giving up when it comes to stopping the human.
Sans talks about trying to steer the human in the right direction in other hypothetical timelines where the human has different LV values. His comments suggest that thereâs not much more he can do to get the human to change their trajectory.
Sans understands that timelines are jumping back and forth in the timespace continuum and he deeply suspects (or knows) that Frisk is a time traveler. He knows that in the Genocide Route, the end result of the timeline is different than for other timelines. The end result of the Genocide Route is the destruction of the monster world... and thatâs the only one where he steps up to do something about the human when he âjudgesâ them.
So to me it seems like Sans letting the human by is based upon his ideas that there is nothing he can do to stop the human from killing people. If he stops the human in a fight, the human will just go back to a previous SAVE point and try again. So he gives up trying to stop the human, does nothing when he âjudgesâ except suggest the human be nice, and only makes an effort to stop the human when the timeline is truly in danger (the Genocide Route).
And the longer version of what I just outlined:
1. Sans talks about giving up several times. He even talks about giving up when it comes to stopping the human.
One oft-quoted comment from Sans comes from when he is a Lost Soul. âjust give up. i did,â he says. Another comment he says here is âwhy even try?â The interesting thing about the Lost Soul dialogue is that all the characters seem to be talking about their greatest internal struggle as Lost Souls - suggesting that one of Sansâ biggest personal problems is giving up.
What is Sans giving up on? As far as I can tell, Sansâ only other comments about âthrowing in the towelâ are regarding him stopping the human.Â
There is his comment in the Genocide Route about how he feels he has to fight the human in this timeline because of what comes next: the destruction of the monster world:
all i know is... seeing what comes next... i canât afford not to care anymore.
Here, he says he can no longer sit back apathetically. This suggests that Sans usually defaults to letting the human pass in the final corridor, regardless of whether the human is a pacifist or not-such-a-pacifist. Him saying he doesnât care usually means that Sans doesnât seem to be âjudgingâ the human with full effort. Instead, heâs only deciding to do something at this moment of judging in the Genocide Route because of âwhat comes nextâ - the end of the timespace continuum.
2. Sans talks about trying to steer the human in the right direction in other actual or hypothetical timelines where the human has different LV values. His comments suggest that thereâs not much more he can do to get the human to change their trajectory.
Even outside the Genocide Route, Sans has different dialogue as a judge depending upon what LV the human is. Some of the words he says appear to correlate with this idea of âjust give up.â I especially find his words interesting when the human is between LV 10 and 13:
hmmm⌠over lv9, huh. thatâs over halfway to lv20, the maximum. but donât think that means youâre still 50- percent good. 50-percent, 20-percent. those are both still failing grades. besides. chances are⌠iâve already tried to steer you in the right direction. so what can i say? what can i say that will change the mind of a being like youâŚ?
Iâve bolded what I find particularly interesting. Sans comments that heâs probably already tried to convince the human to go in the right direction and not kill monsters. But at the same time, his questions suggest that he doesnât know a way to change the humanâs mind to go a better path. He cannot do anything more to get the human to be a better person.âWhat can I say?â he asks, a question that sounds a bit like giving up on trying to change the human. Itâs almost like he lets the human pass because he knows it will make no difference to their actions and to the result of the timeline.Â
3. Sans understands that timelines are jumping back and forth in the timespace continuum and he deeply suspects (or knows) that Frisk is a time traveler. He knows that in the Genocide Route, the end result of the timeline is different than for other timelines. The end result of the Genocide Route is the destruction of the monster world... and thatâs the only one where he steps up to do something about the human when he âjudgesâ them.
Multiple quotes throughout the game demonstrate that Sans has decent knowledge about the unique time properties of this world. If Frisk has not killed anyone and returns to talk to Sans multiple times at the judging point, heâll give Frisk a secret codeword, âso i know if someone tells it to me⌠theyâll have to be a time traveller.â Then, of course, there is that large chunk of dialogue in the Genocide Route where he comments:
our reports showed a massive anomaly in the timespace continuum. timelines jumping left and right, stopping and starting⌠until suddenly, everything ends.
So the reason Iâm bringing up Sansâ knowledge of time traveling, the SAVE function, alternate timelines, etc. âŚis that it seems like his knowledge of Friskâs time traveling capabilities might influence how he acts as a judge. And the reason why Iâm bringing up Sansâ apathy and comments of âjust give upâ is because it could play into the concept of why Sans doesnât do anything when he usually judges the human. All these ideas culminate together in yet another Genocide Route quote:
you canât understand how this feels. knowing that one day, without any warning⌠itâs all going to be reset. look. i gave up trying to go back a long time ago. and getting to the surface doesnât really appeal anymore, either. cause even if we do⌠weâll just end up right back here, without any memory of it, right? to be blunt⌠it makes it kind of hard to give it my all.
It seems from these quotes that Sans knows Frisk can reset and return to relive moments that have happened before - with some variation on the humanâs LV. It seems that Sans knows that there is nothing direct he can do to prevent these timeskips from occurring and repeating. If the human dies, timelines will yet again reverse (as correlated to the humanâs last SAVE point) and events repeat.
It also seems that Sans knows that there is something special about the timeline if the human is a LV 1 or a LV 20. If the human is a LV 1, he might give the human his secret password to prove they are a time traveler. Sans doesnât give the code word to the human for any other LV. Then, if the human is a LV 20, Sans will take action to prevent the human from destroying the entire monster world. But if the human is a LV 4 or a LV 9 or a LV 16, Sans will give the human some suggestions that they probably should not harm anyone⌠but he always lets the human pass, perhaps because it doesnât matter. The net outcome of Frisk not reaching a True Ending will happen whether they are a LV 2 or LV 19. There wonât be a full RESET, timelines will keep jumping back and forth like Sansâ reports indicate, and nothing will get âcompletedâ until the human either goes full pacifist or full genocider.
Now, Iâm not trying to say that Sans has special knowledge of the game or has this acute understanding of game mechanics. But his Genocide Route quote does indicate that he is putting his apathy aside to stop the human⌠because if he doesnât stop the human in this route, then âsuddenly, everything ends.â Heâs willing to fight the human in the Genocide Route because the Genocide Route ending is different. Itâs that horrific. Sans doesnât have knowledge to everything, but the reports heâs seen on the timespace continuum suggest that he really does need to step up. The reports say that the timelines jump and stop until âsuddenly, everything ends,â suggesting an end to all timelines, suggesting an end to the monster world, and suggesting such a terrible fate that Sans canât be his typical apathetic self.
So when the human isnât a LV 20, Sans doesnât have to worry about everything suddenly ending and the timelines being ominously truncated. In a non-Genocide Route, Sansâ reports of the timespace continuum would not indicate the monster world was in imminent danger of ending. Therefore, he could understand that the loop of timelines jumping back and forth would just keep happening regardless of whether Frisk is a LV 2 or LV 12.Â
To use the quote from #2, Sansâ comment when Frisk is over LV 9 makes sense. Sans might not remember other timelines where he judged the human, but from his timespace reports, itâs likely the human has come to him before with an undesirable LV, heâs tried to convince them to change, but the human is still here with a high LV anyway. Sans canât do anything to stop this cycle. So he might as well just give up on this current timeline, let the human pass, and get this current timeline cycle over and done with.
Itâs oddly actually in Sansâ favor to let the human pass and fight Asgore in all routes but the Genocide Route. If Frisk reaches Asgore in the Genocide Route, the king is dead and the underground is in grave danger of being obliterated. But in all other routes, Frisk has to pass Asgore to either finish the Neutral Route or find the True Pacifist Ending. If Sans lets Frisk pass, then presumably he can get out of this current timeline more quickly. But even if Sans doesnât understand that much, he probably understands this:
If Sans tries to stop Frisk in a route that is under LV 20, the human is just going to keep returning to previous SAVE points and fight Sans again and again. Thereâs no point in Sans killing Frisk because the human will just return for another timeline. So itâs in Sansâ favor to let the human pass regardless because him fighting the human here doesnât matter. One way or another, one timeline or another, the human is going to pass him and meet Asgore. Sans knows that killing the human wonât stop them⌠so he can just let them go, even if theyâre a horrific murderer.
So what does Sans do with this knowledge? He says some words to Frisk. He âjudgesâ them. Sans does the only thing he can do: hint to the human that everyone is better off if they are a LV 1. Sans has given up stopping the human, but he hasnât completely given up on trying to steer the human in the right direction. Heâll still suggest to the human that they should be pacifistic. In all the routes Sans judges Frisk, he hints to the human that a LV 1 score is ideal, that they shouldnât kill monsters.Â
Thatâs all he can do to get this timespace continuum ordeal straightened out in his favor, where the timeline is one where he and his companions reach the surface.
Sans being a âjudgeâ isnât necessarily some official role. Thereâs no indication that what he is doing is official. It feels a little odd because heâs talking in more formal language (with capital letters and better punctuation). But that could all be in his favor to try to get the human to listen to him... part of his tactic to convince the human to do a LV 1 route.
I think that Sans telling Frisk he believes they can do the right thing ties back to the idea Sans is trying to convince Frisk to pursue a Pacifist Route⌠not necessarily because Sans is a dieheart pacifist, but because he has reports on the timespace continuum. So long as Frisk isnât on a Genocide Route, thereâs no point to Sans stopping the human, so he might as well just give up trying to do that. I feel Sans isnât necessarily following his morals moreso as he is being pragmatic here.
I donât think thereâs any way knowing whether or not Sans actually is a pacifist at heart. This is just my interpretation of the game, though. Feel free to believe he is a pacifist! I suppose this is just why I myself am not convinced. Iâm not convinced that his comment from MTT Resort about killing the human is genuine, but Iâm not sure that I can conclude heâs a pacifist, either.
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I always wondered how they would get Vane to have some personal stakes in everything since he's always been more about protecting the people around him rather than any grand goals and, well, I guess destroying his hometown sure is one way to do it. Poor guy just keeps losing people dear to him.
yeah that sure helped "raising up the stakes"
tho i feel like more than losing people close to him, it really was just.... the fact he was forced to fight the people he wanted to protect at all cost, that really is his breaking point.
and the way he reflects on that after the fact and wonder who he is supposed to protect when people on both sides are people he's meant to protect, is what really is going to raise the stakes with him.
Him losing more and more people though... genuinely is tragic. Like he just constantly has to watch them die in front of him huh.
Ironically he ends up being the knight that has the most ties to death in general. Like, all of them lost people close to them, but for Vane that's starting to be a high number of people + the fact he's the one who sees ghosts + the fact he's the one who dies in an alternative timeline. the guy is just followed by death all around, and his ideal would be to be able to protect anyone, ever, regardless of which sides they're on, which just have him stand in the heart of more and more death.
it's going to be tough on him for sure from then on. He'll probably have a harder time dealing with things that will ask for him to take sides into consideration, especially now that he knows that this caused the death of parental figures.
it's just something i'm thinking about, but whenever they go through with Mordred switching sides or not once his past is revealed, i do feel like this could work as a cataclyst to have Vane wonder just to which extends he can protect the people he cares about when protecting them would end up hurting others people he wants to protect. Something like that.
I do worry also about him keeping his grief away from Lancelot, though i'm glad he could talk it out with Percival at least... i just hope that him trying to carry everything on his own isn't a set up for him ultimately breaking later because he didn't rely on Lancelot.
You know, I thought for sure that the Sanrio collab was going to turn out to be just some really weird dream Percival had just because he's the only one who's even remotely questioning things, but the more characters get thrown into the mix, the more I'm doubting it. Still, it's so funny seeing him be the only person who's clearly not into any of this lmao
HELP. I'm honestly 100% sure this is all real, Percival is just having another one of these moments where he's dragged into a situation forced to be the straight man while everyone around him is dragging him into loosing it up.
It's honestly so funny, meanwhile, because Aglovale is happy, Percival cannot actually be mad or genuinely complain. So now look at him. wearing bunny ears. So cute.
I've been reminded that Nehan's fate episode mentions that the Karm clan is connected to the people who experimented on Shinsha, so I guess most likely Seox needs to annihilate the clan because if they're still around then the experiments on Shinsha become even worse which leads to... That
o
OH MY GOD???????
That explains completely why Shinsha went completely out of control in this timeline where Seox didn't massacre the clan... holy shit.....
God the fact this boy has to go through the most traumatic act of mass murder in order to stop THE APOCALYPSE is truly fucked up đ
And it would make sense indeed if the Karm clan was indeed involved in the experiments that they could only get worse if they were still alive, considering how much they kept experimenting with new poisons and drugs to amplify powers and stuff...
god that's so fucked up what the hell. We have to doom Seox and Nehan to a horrible fate to save the world..........