#dorotheus method

Predicting the number of children you'll have

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This post is based on a DM I got recently, I didn't have time to explain to them as clearly as possible so I thought it would be interesting to touch on a Dorotheus of Sidon method; derived from writings in Carmen Astrologicum specifically to predict the number of children you'll have. Masterlist

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This is a brief post explaining how the method is used to predict the number of children one will have.

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♀Step 1:

•So to begin, look at the sign your Jupiter is in. Then look for their triplicity lords ; It’s an old concept, similar but less "impactful" compared to domicile, exaltation, exile and fall.

•This is a Hellenistic/medieval astrology method, so it's done using WHOLE SIGNS. Other than that Pluto, Chiron, Neptune & Uranus will not be taken into account for the calculations.

♀Step 2:

•Determine the triplicity lords (rulers) of said sign & it's order according to your chart (day vs night) .

For example, if your Jupiter is Aries and your natal Sun is in the 7th-12th house (day chart). Focus your triplicity ruler as Sun.

While if your natal Sun is in the 1st-6th house (night chart) focus on Jupiter.

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Here is a reference chart you can use; from Anthony Louis (Astrology & Tarot blog).

Fertile signs & sterile (non-fertile) signs (top)

Fairly fertile signs & fairly sterile signs (bottom)

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♀ Rules:

If Mars or Saturn is present in any of the signs from the AC to the triplicity lord, that will signify a loss or miscarriage.

If Jupiter or Venus is present then the chance of having children is doubled. The same can be said if the sign is double bodied (Pisces, Sagittarius, Virgo,Gemini). Could also mean twins. Though Virgo & Gemini are sterile signs there can be certain exceptions (like if there are two or more fertile/twin planets (Jupiter, Mercury,Venus). One isn't really enough to result in a child though.

It's not like you won't have the ability to have your own children, if your partner has quite fertile placements then you will have children, it's just that you will just face some delays or fertility issues at first.

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♀Step 3:

•To determine where you start applying this concept, look at where your triplicity lords & determine which one is stronger (day vs night).

•For example, with an Aries Jupiter in a day chart Sun is more dominant than Jupiter. From there, count the number of signs from the ascendant to the dominant triplicity lord.

♀Step 4:

•Determine whether those signs are in good placement or not (refer to the sterile vs fertile chart given).

♀Timing:

The timing of this method is rather vague, but it does give an estimate. If the triplicity lords are in the ascendant or midheaven, (assuming they are fertile & benefic) then the native will have a child in their youth which is like 20s to early 30 (personally, I believe if Part of Fortune is present it will also indicate this).

On the other hand, if these lords come after the 1st house towards the 7th or even 8th house then they're likely to have a child in their middle ages (during/after late 30s).

William Lilly also has a method of predicting timing (mostly answering the question whether the individual will get pregnant/a child that year or now). Though, I'm not really going to touch on the "timing" topic in this post.

Note: usually if the triplicity lord is in the ascendant, there will be no children/one child depending on the sign (especially if saturn is present) however, that also depends on the other planets occupying this house as well as the sign it's in.

♀Examples:

Michael Jackson

Michael Jackson has 3 children (that we know of, though technically if we count it as his day chart he only has 1 biological kid). His Jupiter is Libra & he has a night chart. His triplicity lord we'll count is Mercury. We'll count from the ASC to his mercury ( following the zodiacal order) so there are 5 signs ; Aquarius, Capricorn, Sagittarius, Scorpio & Libra.

However, Capricorn is sterile & Saturn is in Sagittarius. So that leaves Scorpio, Aquarius & Libra. Three children.

Still don't understand? See simplified version here.

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Beyoncé

Beyoncé (updated birth time) has Jupiter in Libra, and she has a day chart so we will count from the ascendant to Saturn.

There are 5 signs. Pisces, Aquarius, Capricorn, Sagittarius & Scorpio. Fertile, sterile, sterile, sterile, fertile ( double).

She has 3 children. Blue Ivy, then the twins. There was a five year gap between the pregnancies.

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Northopalshore (gaia)

Predicting my children; My Jupiter is also in Libra. I have a day chart. My Jupiter triplicity lords are Saturn-Mercury-Jupiter.

Saturn is stronger than Mercury, so I'll be counting from my ASC to Saturn. There are 7 signs; Aquarius, Capricorn, Sagittarius, Scorpio, Libra, Virgo & Leo.

Capricorn, Virgo & Leo are sterile. Mars is in Scorpio. So there's Sagittarius (w venus), Aquarius, & Libra. So I'll likely have 3-4 children. With a possible miscarriage because of mars. Also since I have Saturn in my 5th house ʕ⁠´⁠•⁠ ⁠ᴥ⁠•̥⁠`⁠ʔ.

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***disclaimer: educational purposes only, reader discretion is advised***

Thanks for reading ˚ʚ♡ɞ˚

@northopalshore

♀It seems like a lot of people are having trouble understanding it lmao. I'm sorry if the way I explained it wasn't as simple as I thought it would be but essentially it's like this;

Dorotheus Method; simplified

It is a bit complicated at first (because it involves some specific terminology & a set of rules) but all you need to refer to is the Triplicity Lord chart, see if you have a Night (sun in houses 1-6) or Day (sun in houses 12-7) chart & whether the signs are considered fertile or not (the chart is in that post).

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Always count from the ascendant (clockwise), past the 12th, 11th, 10th, 9th (don't go from ascendant to the 1st, 2nd & 3rd) & so on until you reach the sign before the Dominant Triplicity ruler (refer to the triplicity chart & day vs night dominant).

Fertile sign? Child. Count it.

Sterile sign? No child. Don't count it.

If Jupiter or Venus is in a particular sign, even if it's considered sterile the chances of a child manifesting is heightened. If it's in a fertile sign or double bodied sign, it could mean twins or double the amount.

If Mars or Saturn is on those signs however, it likely means a miscarriage or a termination. Something might hinder the prospect of that child's presence.

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♀ For this, it's really important to know what context or usage you are trying to apply the triplicity rulers with. I'm going to assume this ask is referring to the Dorotheus method (predicting the number of children you'll have) that I posted?

I've placed the triplicity rulers chart in the initial post.

But if you're having difficulty understanding, let me show you. Since you have Jupiter in Leo, we're going to refer to the chart here (or in my previous posts) and look at the "Triplicity Lords" section.

In Leo, they are Sun (labeled day) , Jupiter (labeled night) & Saturn. Your sun is in the 1st house, therefore you have a night chart ( sun in houses 1 - 6). Then you'll be focusing on Jupiter itself since this is the "strongest" triplicity lord.

Then, refer to the fertility chart that I've placed in the initial post. Leo is considered sterile (infertile). We are counting from the ascendant to the strongest triplicity lord to determine how many children one will have (always count the fertile signs only) clockwise 🔃 (1st, 12th, 11th etc). Never counter clockwise (1st, 2nd, 3rd etc).

So in your case, having the strongest triplicity lord in the 1st house in this sign means no children. However, if Venus is here then there may be a possibility of one child . If mars or Saturn is also here then there will be a miscarriage or loss of a child (refer to Beyoncé chart in the example for the "special cases" i.e strongest triplicity lord in the 1st house).

This is how it works according to Dorotheus' Method. ʕ⁠´⁠•⁠ᴥ⁠•⁠`⁠ʔ

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I just have a quick question (if you’re open to answering, if not, totally fine! 😊).

I used the Dorotheus of Sidon method and my triplicity ruler Venus (Taurus jupiter, day chart) is in the same sign as my ascendant which is Virgo (Similar to Beyoncè except the Venus is in the 12th) It’s also the only planet in that sign, and house, and there’s nothing between it and the ascendant. I know this typically means no/one child but with the influence of Venus and Virgo, does this change the potential to three or four? With the possibility of twins?

Thank you so much! Even if you choose not to answer because you’re the only person i’ve seen give such a detailed explanation of this method!!

𝄞⨾𓍢ִ໋ Virgo is considered a sterile sign which means it doesn't produce a child. Beyoncé has her triplicity lord in Libra in the 1st house, which is a fairy fertile sign (it's why she's able to have almost 4 kids with Venus & Jupiter's influence but Saturn's presence took one away).

On its own, I'm afraid that the likelihood of having a biological child is very low even if the triplicity lord is Venus. Unless your partner's triplicity lord is in a very fertile sign (like cancer &pisces especially then you may see multiple children according to their placements) , even then you may experience a period of "drought" or having no children for quite some time after marriage.

My parents have a similar case. My father's triplicity lord is Sun & it's conjuncting Jupiter. The only problem is that it's in Leo which is a sterile sign. My mother's triplicity lord is Venus and it's in Cancer. It took them 7 years to have their first child (me) after marriage, 3 more years for the 2nd child & 4 more years for their last child. They have 3 children together.

So don't be distraught, perhaps like my parents it will take time to manifest for you too!

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𝄞⨾𓍢ִ໋ Helloo

In your case, it's a bit similar to Beyoncé in the example I added in that post. I'd still count it as a possibility to have around 2-4 children since cancer itself is a fertile sign.

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i have a doubt about the children method :< if i did it right it would mean i wont have children at all 😞 i have asc in virgo, day chart, and my dominant to count is venus in gemini (that i have in 10h whole sing), i know that leo doesnt count and then saturn in cancer cancels it, meaning that i wont have children at all

my question: is there a possibility that my jupiter in virgo (even tho is in 1h) could give me twins or two children? or my mars thats before the venus? i would love to have three in the future 🥺

thank u so much!!! have a beautiful day! <3

♀Hello

So Virgo Jupiter, day chart, Venus is the stronger triplicity ruler. Your Venus is in the 10th house (here).

Normally, we don't count the ascendant itself (unless the triplicity lord is sitting there) again, I've added Beyoncé's chart as an example in the main post.

Here, Venus is in Gemini (which could produce twins or two separate children) sometimes even if the sign isn't considered fertile. However, as mars is here, there will likely be an issue with one of them.

At most you'll likely have 2 children but 1 is guaranteed.

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Goodness. Three kids. Hahaha. That's quite a lot. Lol.

♀Hello!

It doesn't cancel the effects of Jupiter fully, but it takes one away if that makes sense. Like if you're supposed to have two, one will remain or you may have complications with the other child during pregnancy.

Like Beyoncé, she has both good and bad planets there which I've already explained in the main post. Her's is interesting since the dominant triplicity ruler is in the ascendant.

It's hard to really picture ourselves with more than one kid before it actually happens lol. But that's just how life sort of works, we just come around to it eventually. It's kind of sweet. By then, we'd have a life different than the one we currently live in. It's both exciting & frightening lol.

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I have a scorpio jupiter and night chart. So triplicity lord should be mars cause it’s stronger than moon and mercury. My mars is in 8th house, so I counted from the ascendant till the sign before the triplicity lord:

Virgo (12th house), leo (11th), cancer (10th), and gemini (9th).

So it’d be one child (cancer) then twins (gemini)

♀ Helloo

Scorpio Jupiter night chart (triplicity lords: Mars-Moon- Venus in that order) Mars (night) is stronger than venus (day) here.

Essentially, that's right. As for Gemini, there could be a likelihood of twins (usually solidified if Jupiter or venus is here) if not, then count it as two separate children. So you're likely going to have 3 kids somewhere along your life.

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