#con interview

Fidel's backstory in the movie Frank (2012) :)) <3

Question: Fidel obviously had quite a unique look. Was there any thought of where he came from or did you just...

Con: Oh yes. Yeah, you [at the writer and direcor Richard Heslop] tell the story. This is what hooked me, this story. This is how he sold it to me over the phone.

RH: There was a back story which we took out which was Fidel was on a clown themed orgy on a boat and his girlfriend had just seen Fidel go a bit too far and she just hit him over the head with her stiletto shoe and pushed him overboard. That's why he is such a misogynist and hates women so much. But we took that bit out, we just thought, let's not have an explanation. We got rid of a lot of script."

Con O'Neill interview with Awards Radar's Steven Prusakowski 😭😭😭❤❤❤

SP: Busy time of year, but, you know, starting to slow down in just enough to hang out with the family and do all the cooking for, like 48 hours and then.

Con: Are you the main cook in the house?

SP: I am the main cook.

Con: Yeah. So am I. I love it.

SP: I love it, too.

Con: It's my go to place.

SP: Yeah.

Con: Because when I left school, I trained to be a chef.

SP: Oh, wow.

Con: Briefly. Another story.Okay, let's rock and roll.

SP: Well, that passion never leaves you, I think. I think once you start, especially when someone enjoys and says, hey, I really liked your food.I hear from my daughter's friends or their parents, she loved your pasta or whatever it was, I'm like, okay, now I'm...

Con: It's the best feeling, isn't it?

SP: It is. It's wonderful.

Con: And just that kind of inherent, nurturing thing of just going into the kitchen empty handed and coming out with a meal for people is really rewarding. And I love it. It's intoxicating. I absolutely love it.

SP: Same here.

Con: Because I travel so much, I don't always get a place with a kitchen. And that's why I always try and get an apartment when I'm filming because it just gives me a place to be in my head that isn't about work.

SP: Yeah. Yeah. Well, I can talk cooking forever, but-

Con: But we should.

SP: I know we're short on time and I have a ton of questions and I won't get to all of them. So let's just jump into the series and maybe we could pick it back up. Sorry to interrupt, but I love the series. I love your character and your performance.

Con: Thank you.

SP: It's a stellar, and there's so much to Izzy that we see on the surface, but there's so much more to him beneath. How was this character originally pitched you and what did you initially want to bring to him?

Con: The thing about this character was he wasn't in the pilot. So when I spoke to David about it, there was nothing written. So he explained it in very broad terms. But then I quite like specifics when I'm choosing projects. And kind of... he brought up Salieri from Amadeus, and I really hooked into that. Now, I don't know whether we went that way with it in the end, but it was a really good hook for me because Salieri is that guy with a mission who is on the surface wanting, but is underneath something else. And I think initially, Izzy was that, but then we exploded him in several other ways and Salieri diminished to something else. But it was a good hook for me

initially to get in by thinking about Salieri.

SP: Yeah, I like it. I could see that for sure. And to start the season two. So going into that, he's a shadow of himself from this feared, intense, strong man to a broken man. And what was it like taking this character and exposing that humanity and starting to peel away some of that shield.

Con: I mean... David had spoken to me before we started shooting and explained most of the hulk to me, and I'd always played Izzy as a man who was in love but didn't know he was in love. And for me, the key into this season was a. the design, but more importantly, was the Taika's performance. To see a man that I love to be that broken and to be that vicious because of the heartbreak, it was profound for me to see what he did with Blackbeard, and it did break my heart a little bit. So the emotional journey was quite clear that at the end of the day, all hatred of Stede had left him, and all he wanted to do is fix Blackbeard, and he risks his life to do that. He literally puts himself on the line for that because, like always. And what I loved about what David and the writers did was they didn't remove Izzy from season one in season two, he's still there. And what Izzy does is about the crew. He puts his life on the line because Blackbeard is killing his crew, and he risks it all for that. But it breaks him seeing the the man he loves so fragile and broken and angry, it breaks him. So, It wasn't an easy job. It was quite a lonely job. It was quite a difficult job because it was going down that path that I knew inevitably we were going to go down. But I thought it was beautifully written. So most of what I needed to do was on the page, to be honest-

SP: -I'm sorry-

Con: I just had to throw myself into it.

SP: Excellent. And then with Izzy being broken and literally broken, he loses his leg, which is symbolic of much more. It leads to one of the most touching moments of the series, a note with four words: For The New Unicorn. What did that mean to you, and what does that mean to the character?

Con: You know, I've been talking a lot last couple of days - because I'm allowed to now - and, you know, this season is about Izzy coming out. In many ways, he comes out, but that moment, that rest, that beautiful piece of writing again, the writing, where the crew embrace him, and it just releases him. It releases him from his own concept of who he is. It releases him from his own concept of who he has to

be to be a first mate and a brilliant first mate. It released him of concept that he's alone. None of this would have been possible to Izzy pre season one, none of it. And in many ways, it's Stede that brings this into his life. Because before Stede, Izzy never thought of his relationship with Blackbeard as a loving relationship. He never thought of it as being in love. He only realizes he's in love with Blackbeard when he sees Blackbeard lose Stede. That's the only... The reveal is he's heartbroken because the man he loves is broken, and he doesn't know what to do with any of that. He's not emotionally capable. And the crew giving him the letter and calling him the new unicorn and releasing him from all the stuff that he'd done, all that pain that he'd suffered and anger that he'd raged upon them, it's a really accepting moment. So... yeah, I'm waffling a bit now, but it meant a lot, and it was a very beautiful moment to play. And I thought Andy, who directed it, directed it so...Andy was a real shoulder for me to lean on in those scenes, because a lot of those early scenes I'm shooting on my own. And it's quite difficult to play an emotional narrative when you're on your own, because it tends to just be one tone. And he was wonderful, and Alyssa and Alex and all. They were all wonderful in helping me gauge those moments, as were the rest of the cast. But, yeah, that moment touched me enormously.

SP: You know, you have this love triangle that is never really spoken, but it's there.

Con: Yeah

SP: Then it kind of shifts - it's almost like a love square. It's Ed, Blackbeard, Izzy and Stede. And where the love, you know, crosses, it's all... or the hatred is at sometimes, but then it evolves...

Con: Absolutely.

SP: It's so complex.

Con: I mean we all're in contemporary language. We always associate love with romance. That isn't the case here. The love that Blackbeard and Izzy have for each other is deep, man. It's deep, and it's rooted in years of working together, loving each other, saving each other's lives, being constant. This is probably the only constant they both had in their lives, is Blackbeard is Izzy, Izzy is Blackbeard, and then they have this buffoon come in and steal Blackbeard's heart. It's not that Blackbeard falls in love with someone else. Blackbeard falls in love with this guy. This Izzy just can't comprehend, and it's a constant. And then once, I think once Blackbeard hands him the gun, everything changes. And Blackbeard says, kill yourself. Everything changes. And then there's an openness to Stede and Blackbeard that brings him to that place of acceptance-

SP: -It's great to watch also. I'm sorry. Go ahead.

Con: No, that. I mean, I'll waffle again. I'll waffle a lot, because that's what I do. But the more I think about that relationship, the more I go down all these different avenues of what it could have been, and what it could never have been, and what it is and what it wasn't. And as you say, it's layered and complex, and I'm honored to have been able to get to play with those actors, and especially with Taika, who's a profoundly good actor - everyone talks about Taika's director and writer - the man's a fucking great actor to work opposite, and he's... he's exquisite. So, yeah, I could only go where I went because the writers and Taika. Really.

SP: That's great. I... of course, we have to touch upon the end of the season and the end of Izzy, unfortunately, which I'm hoping is not. I'm hoping David has something up his sleeve. But what was your reaction when you learned it and how emotional was shooting that final scene? Because that final scene says a lot between...

Con: It was a... listen, I've been around a long time. The writing was on the wall when I started to read the scripts, and David had kind of hinted at it anyway when we went out for the famous dinner where he told me what the plan was, and I was gutted because I loved playing him so much. But, yeah, narratively, yeah, it makes sense. And I have complete faith, respect, love, admiration for David Jenkins, and whatever he thinks or wants to happen in season three will be the right thing if he gets season three, which I, whether I'm involved in it or not, I really hope he gets it, because he deserves it. And the show deserves it. The show deserves its triangle. It deserves it. But, yeah, it took a few days to sink in, and then I was fine. I was incredibly tired by that time. And I was lonely, as... really lonely because I was so far away from home filming all these scenes, and I tended to isolate when I was filming because of the nature of the work. So when I wasn't filming, I was sword training, or I was working out, or I was learning to walk on that fucking leg, or I was whatever whatever whatever. So I found myself isolating a lot. And in a way, it was a relief to be released from it. The final scene David had sent to me several weeks earlier. And I prepped, as I always do, and I prepped and I prepped and we were going to shoot at the beginning of the last week, and then it got shifted to the middle of the last week, and then it got shifted to the morning of the last day, and then it was shifted to the last thing we were going to shoot in the entire season. And there's always a dark cloud around those scenes because you never quite know how it's going to play. And there's a lot of pressure. And it being the last thing we were going to shoot, put more pressure on. And we were on the ship, which is a huge set, hundreds of crew members, the cast, everyone who could possibly be there was there. And I was getting quite unsettled by the amount of cacophony of noise and people. And then we rigged it all up, and it was still just [noise]. And then suddenly it was just me and Taika and just saying goodbye to a character we both fell in love with. And it was... it was a, I'm saying 'profound' a lot, but it was a profound experience doing that scene because everything else disappeared. It was just me and him. It was just Izzy and Blackbeard. And it was a lovely lovely moment.

SP: It was painful, but-

Con: It was lovely to be held by-

SP: -beautiful to watch.

Con: Yeah. Thank you. I mean, it's lovely to be held by another actor just... creatively and likewise with me to him. And David had a playlist playing and it was... elegant to do. It was nice to do. It was a nice, fitting ending to that chapter of this character. And I'll always be grateful that they shot it in that way.

SP: I do have to wrap. I just want to say before we do, I really enjoyed your rendition of La Vie En Rose. fantastic.

Con: Thank you.

SP: That's beautiful. And I appreciate all the work you did in the series, and I hope we see you again. And hopefully maybe you'll have a cooking show too, along the way, because I'd love to see what you make in that kitchen.

Con: Come on and let's bake together. Oh, I can't bake. I'll cook. It's lovely l ovely talking to you, Stephen.

SP: Great talking to you as well. Have a great day.

Con: Thank you. Bye bye.

COLLIDER: I'm so glad that we finally got the chance to touch base about the show.

CON O’NEILL: Yeah. It's been really uncomfortable not being able to talk about it.

COLLIDER: Izzy, as a character, really goes on a beautiful, poignant journey this season. In the beginning, Ed is Blackbeard and back to the old lifestyle of raiding and pillaging ships, but it feels like something's off. Izzy has what he wanted back, but at what cost? What was your take on that — reverting to the way that things used to be, but, obviously, there's been a shift, and things aren't quite the same?

O’NEILL: It goes back to how it used to be, but Ed’s broken, and that's the difference. Before Stede appeared, Izzy and Blackbeard worked as a unit really, really well because they were both on the same page. When Stede breaks Blackbeard's heart, Izzy and Blackbeard aren't on the same page. Basically, Izzy’s looking at a man that he loves falling apart, and all the joy is gone — not just from Blackbeard, but from piracy. He can see Ed's decline, he can see the decline in his crew, which is fundamentally really, really the most important thing to him. He can feel his own heart breaking, because he's seeing the devastating impact of his actions. So, it's a pretty bleak start to a season, but we do have fabulous make-up.

COLLIDER: It does feel bleak, especially for Izzy at times, who goes through the amputation and has to adjust to a new normal of not being able to get around the way that he used to. But it's also an opportunity to see the changing dynamic with the crew. I was really touched by the moment when they built [Izzy] a new leg. It's moving on an emotional level, but it's also proof of how far this group has come. Was it nicer to be able to play those moments of camaraderie instead of being at odds all the time?

O’NEILL: What's interesting, though, is the love for Izzy to his crew and the crew to Izzy, it's always been there. It's just not being presented in this way. The giving of the leg, I believe, is the first time in his life where he's actually had an emotional connection that he wasn't able to control. That act of kindness overwhelms it. But he's still a pirate, and the leg ultimately allows him to be a pirate again. He does change his attitude towards his crew after the new leg and after the unicorn statement, but it's also about how to navigate the new crew as the first mate. And that's the beauty of what David's written. It's not suddenly he's this new guy. He's still a bit of a dick, but he's their dick, as Vico says.

It's a beautiful human version of the story that could have been really sentimental, and I don't think we go there. He doesn't suddenly become everyone's mate. That was never going to happen. That would have been dishonest. But he just has a need for them more because he's not as physically able as he used to be, and with that comes an understanding of them. The way he deals with Lucius is very specific in that he can't give Lucius love and understanding without calling him a twat — because that's who Izzy is, but he does give him love and understanding — and that's down to David and David's choices. Remember, this is a comedy. He's done all this in a comedy. That's really profound that we're going on these routes of human stories in what is essentially a comedy.

COLLIDER: One that really stuck out to me was Izzy singing in the “Calypso's Birthday” episode, especially because it plays as a backdrop to some pretty significant moments. I wanted to ask you about the preparation process behind performing that song. Did you have to record it and also do it live on-set?

O’NEILL: I got an email from David a third of the way through the shoot asking me if I knew “La vie en rose,” which, of course, I knew, but only as I'd heard it. I was actually in Wellington filming a different show because I did a different show for a week, and I just got this message. We were just gonna sing the English version because we didn't have the rights to the French version, and I don't speak any French at all. Nothing. Zilch. And then I got the phone call. Would I be able to learn it in French? So I did. I called a lot of people, and a lot of people who say they speak French don't. But my partner does, and I have a friend who just played Piaf. So, between the two of them, they gave me an understanding of the French.

We recorded both versions, and I lip-synced to the English version first before the scene with Ned. I thought we were just gonna do a little bit of the French version for the end of the episode. I had no understanding that it was gonna play out the episode. I’m thrilled that it does, but it was terrifying. Every minute of that, from the recording of it to the lip-syncing it to the filming it, was terrifying. I haven't sung in public for 20 years. But it felt right, and it felt like the absolute right choice of song. It felt like the absolute right choice of language. I didn't want him to be too French, I just wanted him to be able to because Izzy speaks bits of every language, as most pirates would. I thought it was audacious. I thought it was moving. I thought, again, it shied away from sentimental. And I’m just in awe of how David's brain works. If you would have asked me prior to doing it which song Izzy would sing, I'd never have thought “La vie en rose,” and now I can't think of a song that's more appropriate for Izzy.

COLLIDER: I talked to David, as well, about the scene of Izzy talking about piracy in the finale, and he said it's kind of like Izzy giving his own eulogy, in a way, before what happens next. That scene where Taika is holding you feels significant for the show — not just in terms of the weight and impact, but because so much of the cast is there, and it really feels like a moment of family getting to be together. Even if it's mostly an exchange between Izzy and Ed, everyone's there to send him off. I would love to hear about the experience of filming that on the day.

O’NEILL: David sent me the scene a few weeks prior, and the date was set to film it, which was gonna be in the last week of filming. It was early on in the last week, and then it was in the middle of the last week, and then it was scheduled for the morning of the last day. Then, suddenly, it became the last thing we were gonna ever film in Season 2.

Those things aren't easy. They're quite difficult because no matter how you think about it in your head, it's not gonna play that way. We were on a set, we were on the ship, there were hundreds of crew, there was the whole cast, they were setting up the shot. It was busy. David, bless him, played a playlist to help us all get in the mood, but it's just a cacophony of noise and busyness, and we’re getting towards the end of the day.

Suddenly, it was just me and Taika. Suddenly, all the noise disappeared, and suddenly, all the process of filming a scene disappeared, and it was just me and him. And Taika is a wonderful actor. Everyone talks about his writing and his directing, and this and that. Taika is a beautiful actor to play opposite. And in that moment, we just got to say goodbye to a character that we both loved. You never get a death scene that's going to get all those boxes, but for me, it was never about what Izzy said. It was about Izzy being vulnerable enough and brave enough to say, “Sit with me.” It was about Izzy being allowed to be held in the last moments of his life. That's all I remember about the day. I’m very proud of it.

COLLIDER: I just want to say thank you so much for taking the time to chat with me about the show. It's been great to finally get to reconnect with the cast and to really get to talk about Season 2.

O’NEILL: Oh, it’s my pleasure. It’s my pleasure.

COLLIDER: I’ve enjoyed your performance so much these last two seasons, and who knows? Maybe we'll see Izzy's ghost pop up in Season 3.

O’NEILL: Who knows?

COLLIDER: You can't predict anything with this show.

We said goodbye to Izzy this season. What was your initial reaction to learning his fate, and how did you prepare for his death?

Con O’Neill: You know what, I’ve been around a long time, and going through those first few scripts and seeing which way the arc was going, it didn’t surprise me. I was upset because I loved playing him, but at the same time, I think David knows what he’s doing, and we are all here because of David Jenkins, first and foremost. So I got it. I made him pay for dinner, but I got it nonetheless. And then it was just a matter of honoring what they’d written. And they kept surprising me every episode. He kept giving me stuff that took my breath away and challenged me enormously. And yeah, if you’re going to go out, go out like that.

What message would you want to share with fans who are still struggling with Izzy’s loss?

That’s a big ask, isn’t it? I would say that I have nothing but love, respect, and faith in David Jenkins. Trust him. He knows what he’s doing. None of this was taken lightly. Trust David Jenkins.

When you were preparing for Izzy’s ending, which scene felt like a bigger send-off — that epic monologue delivered to Ricky or his final words to Ed aboard the Revenge?

I remember the day we filmed what turned out to be a eulogy… We shot it several times, and then Fernando [Frias], who was directing that episode, suggested we do one more take and to “let the guard down,” was his phrase. And I didn’t know the guard was up, but that’s the take they used. And there’s an ad-lib in that take as well, which I won’t tell you what it is, which one it is. But I thought the profound moment would be the death. I didn’t understand at the time that the profound moment was the speech. I knew the speech was brilliant. I knew they’d written something extraordinary. Because they played with the narrative a bit in the edit, I didn’t know where it was going to play fundamentally in the final edit. But yeah, it’s basically written and Fernando gave me the key to get where we went to. So thank you, Fernando.

You mention ad-libbing. Was there any scene or moment you got to improvise or enjoyed improvising this season?

I can’t remember. There was a lot this season. That one in the eulogy speech is because I see it being played everywhere all the time at the moment. So I hear that a lot. There was a lot more understanding of character in this season. Ninety-nine percent of ad-libs don’t get in. The thing that’s not often discussed about our show is it’s f**king beautifully written. And we do a lot of takes, and as long as we get what is written down before we do any other playing around, then we’ve done our job because our writers are exceptional. And the joy as an actor — I’m a theater actor from way back — is when you see some of this writing. It’s just brilliant.

You talk about being a theater performer. Were you thrilled to take on Izzy’s musical moment in drag? I was told you learned the French version and English version of “La Vie En Rose” for the episode.

I’d love to say I taught myself, but no, I don’t speak French at all to my shame, but my partner does, and I have a friend called Jenna Russell, who’s just played Edith Piaf in the West End. So between the two of them, they taught me how to [sing the song in French]. And it was just excruciating for both of them… how I bastardized the French language. And bless him, Samba [Schutte] as well was even there when we were doing the lip sync to the recording. Samba was kneeling down, out the shot telling me if my mouth was doing the wrong shape for some of [it]. I mean, it was that extreme, but we got there by the skin of our teeth. But it’s funny if you’d asked me for a song for Izzy, I would never in a million years have thought of “La Vie En Rose.” Now I couldn’t think of any song that suits him better.

What was the process like getting to find Izzy’s drag look? Because it doesn’t feel like he’s embodying a character, but rather an extension of himself.

Quite a lot, to be honest. Nancy [Hennah] first talked to me about it. The drag was on, it was off, it was on, it was off, it was on. It was off. And then when we got close to filming, the drag was on again, and I just didn’t want it to be a comedy. Not that she ever suggested it was, but there were versions of the ideas for the drag which were so extreme that it felt like a parody. And I didn’t want it to be a parody.

Here’s an exclusive for you. When Kristian [Nairn] and I shot the scene where I discovered Wee John doing his makeup, there was one take of the scene where we ended up looking in the mirror together, and I heard myself say, “Make me pretty.” And as gentle as that sounds, it had a profound effect on me because I suddenly realized that that part in [Izzy] that had never been announced before was wanting to announce himself and to be pretty while he was doing it.

And that became really important to me when we were designing the look. And between Nancy, our brilliant makeup designer, and Deb [Watson], my makeup artist, they came up with that look, which I think really honors Izzy as a character, but also made him pretty. It had a profound effect on me when I had myself say those words. I think it’s probably the first time Izzy has ever said the word pretty — and it was about himself. I mean, how lovely is that?

Izzy went through another transformation earlier this season with his peg leg. Was becoming the new “unicorn” of the Revenge vital for his character development this season?

Yeah, I’ve been thinking about this a lot today because I’ve been asked various questions around this theme. And what I think is lovely about Izzy’s arc or Izzy’s redemption is we don’t change who he was. It’s a version of who he was, who is now feeling gratitude and acceptance. And we can talk about the closet, whether it’s an emotional closet or a sexual closet. He comes out of the closet this season, figuratively and visibly, and every queer person has that story. They’re all different versions of the story, but the relief of the coming out process, it’s life-changing. That’s what Izzy does in this season, is he comes out and it’s had a profound effect on the audience. So many of them have already themselves or want to, or need to, and they let him, our writers let him. It’s lovely.

David had said following the finale that there’s no Our Flag Means Death without Izzy. Would you come back for a third season if asked? After all, this is the kind of show where a character can turn into a seagull, so surely there’s room for a ghost.

That’s a conversation you have to have with David. David is the boss on all of this, and I know David always wanted a Season 3. I would be heartbroken for the show if he didn’t get a Season 3 because it deserves it. It’s an important show. If Izzy’s involved, and if he isn’t, I still think it’s a really important show and it should be given its send-off season.

On a more light-hearted final note, we got to see Izzy interact more with Stede as a mentor. What was it like getting to build that dynamic with Rhys in Season 2?

Rachel Leishman interview with Con O'Neill 22.11.2023

Rachel: Hi, Con. How are you?

Con: I'm very well, Rachel. How are you?

Rachel: I'm doing great. To start, so you've now joined the canon of I guess my favorite thing in TV is when people sing La Vie En Rose, because I loved when it happened in How I Met Your Mother and now it happened in Our Flag Means Death. And I was crying through both times. And so getting to kind of have those emotional moments that I didn't even care that the song didn't even exist, I was just happy it was happening. So getting to have those moments where you have those emotional kind of songs and journeys on a show that is outrageous and fun and quirky what for you as an actor is the joy of getting, you know, get to dive into something like that with a character like Izzy Hands that has had such a kind of arc, especially in Season Two.

Con: I knew he was going to go on a journey in Season Two because David had told me and I will be eternally grateful to him and his brilliant writers because they didn't make it sentimental. They didn't suddenly turn him overnight. They gave him a journey that I could work through emotionally and not feel like I was jumping ahead of myself or I was having to cheat. The song itself... had you asked me for a song for Izzy to sing, I would never, ever have picked La Vie En Rose. And now I can't think of any other song Izzy should sing. So again, that's down to David and also to all those people, my partner and Jenna, who's a friend of mine who just played PF in London, who helped me learn the French, which was excruciating for everyone involved.

Rachel: When I interviewed David, I said to him, I was like, you should be in jail for making me care so much about Izzy Hands throughout this whole season and then just put me in so much pain by the end because it was just such a beautiful arc from beginning to end this season. And I can only imagine as an actor the joy of kind of getting to dive into something that kind of rich, because...

Con: It is joyful, but it was incredibly lonely. I found myself spending a lot of time on my own, a) because a lot of the scenes are on my own, and b) if I wasn't filming, I was learning how to walk in that fucking leg, or I was sword training or I was working out or I was learning French or I was recording. It was a very solitary experience doing this season and I loved every minute of the work, but it was challenging on a whole other level that I didn't really think about until I found myself in the middle of it. And, yeah, I'm glad we did it and I'm glad we respected the character that we've created in Season One.

Rachel: And it is... I like, I really enjoyed because I think Taika's performance as Blackbeard especially. I love how kind of different it is because I'm a big fan of his work in general, but I do think it's very different from everything that I've seen from him. And I love the dynamic between Blackbeard and Izzy because that is something that I think as much as Steed and Blackbeard drive this show, without Izzy's love for Blackbeard, I don't necessarily think that relationship would be as strong as it is. And when you guys kind of have the arc you do in Season Two still cool to kind of have that final moment that we end up getting throughout in this show, for you two as actors to kind of in a comedy, get to have that emotional sobbing moment. You're comedians, but you're crying like having this kind of death scene on a beach. What is it for you two as actors and friends to kind of come to that moment where you're like, hey, we're still actors at the end of the day, but we're going to be sobbing on a beach over these two characters?

Con: You know what? I love working with Taika. I love acting with Taika. And Taika is a world renowned Oscar winning writer director actor, but he doesn't nearly get the plaudits he deserves as an actor. And the death scene in particular, I was dreading it because it's massive. And we were going to shoot it in the last week, at the start of the week, then the middle of the week, then the last day was going to be the morning of the last day. And then it ended up being the last thing we shot in the entire shop. And when you're filming something like that on the ship with hundreds of crew and the whole cast, and we're getting towards the end of the day and there's a lot of energy, and then suddenly it was just me and him. And if he hadn't given that to me, I was fucked. But he just held me in it and everything else disappeared. And we just trust the writing and we just do it. And he's a fucking awesome scene partner. There's a lot of good actors in that show, a lot of fucking great actors. But in that moment, I've never felt more collaborative and more trusted and more held than I have in probably my entire career.

Rachel: And you said collaborative. A show like this is kind of the joy of it, is that there are so many characters and it is such a collaborative show as a whole. And I think that's why fans love it as much as we do, because it's such a family unit. And for you as an actor, what is the kind of draw for you to a show like that that is so much a group of actors and comedians that are all kind of together, all on set, working as a unit?

Con: I'm a sporting actor. It's what I do. I like to work with an ensemble. It's how I do my best work. And the cast are sharp, witty, intelligent and also wonderful actors. So it's a no brainer for me. But also the show's... show is about love, and it's about queer love. And it's a show we should have been making a long time ago. It's a show that appreciates its audience and it's a show that is kind and none of our violence in our show is ever ever aimed at anyone for their gender or their sexuality. And we should be making queer of shows like this more. And that's what drew me to it. And when I saw... I was on set, when the boys in the first season, when they filmed the 'you wear fine things well' scene, and I watched it being shot and the beautiful performances and the beautiful dialogue and the way that it was being shot was exquisite. And I suddenly realized not only were we in this pirate show, but we were also in a romantic, queer love story that wasn't going to not be romantic. And I thought, there we are. That's it. That's what people are going to plug into.

Rachel: Yeah. Thank you so much for talking with me. This show means so much to me and people that I know and love. So thank you for talking with me.

Con: My pleasure.

Rachel: And I want more seasons of it. I love it so so so much.

Con: Thank you so much. Rachel.

Rachel: you have a great one.

Con: I think the show deserves a season three whether I'm involved in it or not. It was always David's dream to make three seasons. I would be gutted for him if season three didn't happen. As far as Izzy being involved, that's entirely up to David Jenkins.

Screen Rant: I did some Googling, and I found articles. One of them was titled “Our Flag Means Death Season Two's Best Character Isn’t Who You Think”, and it was talking about Izzy. The other one was “Izzy Hands is the Real Star of Our Flag Means Death Season Two”. Those were both headlines I found. What was it like to find out what Izzy’s journey this season was going to be? It’s had such an impact on so many people.

Con O’Neill: David and I spoke about it quite a lot before we shot, about the redemptive qualities, and I was delighted that we didn't suddenly turn him into a saint overnight. I was delighted that the redemption was complicated and layered, and I don't feel that Izzy disappears in any of it. I think he's very much who he always was, but with slightly more of an open soul. I was so grateful to David and the writers for creating an arc that was playable rather than Hollywood-ized and too easy. It was challenging; it was a very, very lonely shoot for me. I found myself gravitating towards my own company most of the time, mainly because of the hours. And, because if I wasn’t shooting, I was learning to walk on that f***ing leg. If I wasn’t doing that, I was sword training, and if I wasn’t doing that, I was body training, and if I wasn’t doing that, I was recording a song in French. So, I was busy. Our group is a group of beautiful people, and we would meet every Sunday for lunch. Christine used to arrange that. I found myself initially quite hesitant to join that, because it felt like I had this weight on my shoulders, certainly for the first four episodes. I loved it as an actor. I found it really challenging as a man on his own in New Zealand, where it rains [a lot].

Screen Rant: I'm a music nerd, and kind of a musical theater nerd; my favorite episode of this is the one where you're singing in it. I love those sequences so much, your voice is insane, and it's such a good character moment. How did the decision to make that happen—singing, and specifically that song--come about? Did they write that for you because they knew you were a singer?

Con O’Neill: We’re all walking around backstage, telling jokes, playing music, and singing; that’s just what happens when you shoot a show. David called me up while I was in Wellington. I was in Wellington for a week shooting something else. He called me up and he asked me if I knew “La vie en rose”; I knew it, vaguely, but I don't speak French at all. Then, he mentioned that they wanted to do it in an episode. So, I learned the English version, Dean Martin’s version, and then they asked me if I could learn the French version. I don't speak a word of French, not a word, but my partner does, and I had a friend who just played Edith Piaf piano—Jenna (Russell)--and between the two of them, they taught me the French version of the song. If somebody had asked me prior to this, “What song would Izzy sing?” “La vie en rose” would never have entered my head. And now, there's no other song that fits. That's the genius of David. David's very clever with music. We know that--we’ve all experienced how clever he is—but to pick that song for him, at that point in his life? Yeah. F***ing hell. That was genius.

Screen Rant: Your character died this season. How far in advance did you know that, and did that affect how you approached or thought about the season?

Con O’Neill: No. I mean, to be honest, I felt it was going that way. I've been around a long time, and when a character starts this kind of arc, especially in something as interesting as our show is… When David took me out for dinner, I kind of thought this was where it was going, and, partly, I was relieved. I'm not an actor who likes to just repeat, repeat, repeat, repeat, repeat. And, I knew that Ed and Stede were going to end up together at the end of this season, so Izzy, as he stands, wouldn't make any sense to still be there. So, it was a relief that the decision was being made. I was a bit upset because I love playing him, but leave them wanting more, you know? I will be eternally grateful for what they gave me; how they played him out in the show. The beautiful speech they gave me, the opportunity to do “La vie en rose”, and the opportunity to die in Taika’s arms and to be able to honor that relationship… I couldn't have asked for a better play-off, really.

Screen Rant: This season did introduce, with the Gravy Basket, the potential for someone who has passed on to return. If there was a season three, do you think your character would have anything else to impart on Stede or Blackbeard in a similar scenario?

Con O’Neill: You’d have to ask David Jenkins. I don't know where David wants to take it, and I wouldn't preempt that with me making up stories for Izzy in a flashback or ghostie Izzy, or whatever. I have no idea where David wants season three to go. I think the show deserves a season three whether I'm involved in it or not. It was always David's dream to make three seasons. I would be gutted for him if season three didn't happen. As far as Izzy being involved, that's entirely up to David Jenkins.

Screen Rant: So much of this season and Izzy’s journey is his relationship with Edward and his love for Edward, and so much of the conflict is about how much Edward is changing. Did you have an understanding of what version of Blackbeard, or Edward, that Izzy was looking for, and wanting to be around?

Con O’Neill: That’s a great f***ing question. Between season one and season two, in the interim, Izzy experiences a broken Blackbeard, and a Blackbeard that's never going to go back to what he was, because he's heartbroken. Everyone who's been heartbroken knows that you never go back to who [you] were. He just wants to fix Blackbeard. That's why he takes his life in his hands by confronting Blackbeard; he just wants Blackbeard to be fixed, to find his soul again, [and] to find his heart again. Whether he's involved in that is not relevant. What's relevant is, he loves Blackbeard so much that he wants him to find himself again. So, it's never Izzy’s version of Blackbeard that Izzy’s looking for. He's looking for Blackbeard to find himself again, and that's only through Stede.

Screen Rant: I was looking up the real-life Izzy Hands, who testified against allies to get a pardon and supposedly died a beggar in the streets of London years later. Would you have been interested in that, dramatically, if that was how his story ended on the show?

Con O’Neill: No, that's not our show. We're not historically [accurate to] those times. If we were, they wouldn’t have cast a guy who is 50 to play a 16-year-old pirate. I don't know. I'd love to be able to tell you what area that season three, if it ever happens, would go, but I literally have no idea. I don't think we're going to go down the historical route. I’d be very surprised if we do that.

Screen Rant: I don’t know if you’ll have an answer for me, but I saw that you initially auditioned for a different role. I love Taika so much; I feel like you would have also made a great Blackbeard. Is that who you were going for, initially?

Con O’Neill: Absolutely not, but thank you for saying that. I don’t see anyone else as Blackbeard but Taika. When Taika was announced, I knew what our show was. But no, it wasn’t Blackbeard. And no, I’m not going to tell you.

Screen Rant: Okay. Perfect. Well, clearly it all worked out for the best. I mean, you're incredible, and the whole cast is so perfect in their roles. It's been a pleasure to watch you and… yeah, congrats on the show.