"All religions are cults if you think about it"
Actually they're not all cults and you're doing the work of making sure actual cults can slip under the radar when you say stuff like that
Cult leaders LOVE that trend, because they can point to it and say, "people will call anything a cult, it's basically meaningless"
I'm begging you all to stop using the word cult until you really understand what it means
I agree, obviously cults ruin peoples lives and need to be seen as a real problem.
However, scientifically the words "Religion" and "Cult" can't really be meaningfully separated. Any definition of religion narrow enough to exclude all cults also excludes things that are very much seen as legitimate religions and any definition broad enough to include all religions will include things that most agree are definitely cults.
This does not mean that religion in any form is less respectable or that cults are acceptable. Just that the line is blurry. And I think any religious institution should be viewed very closely on how they treat the members and what exactly they preach.
Hey, it's okay to be wrong! The definition of religion doesn't need to exclude or include all cults, because not all cults are religious in nature, but some are. The definitions of cults that most experts use are easy to distinguish from your run-of-the-mill religion. While a religion might fall in to one or two criteria, that doesn't make it a cult.
a way to tell the difference is cults specifically use the BITE model of authoritarian control
Behavior - control member behavior via reward, punishment, manipulation, etc
Information - control information coming in and going out via isolation and propaganda
Thought - discourage critical thinking for oneself to shape attitude
Emotion - guilt, shame, terrorize, create a sense of community and family, etc
all of these tactics are with the express purpose of indoctrination and retainment, which does not apply to all religions, although there can be certain sects that are more likely to use them
another way to tell is cults typically have something to be gained exclusively by those at the top of the pyramid, at the expense of those below. (which can appropriate religion for the purpose of, but doesn't make religions cults)
under this criteria maga, racial supremacy groups, and terfism are cults that aren't religions, but some of which use religion as a means of manipulation btw
This is Daniella Mestyanek:
She's the only cult expert to have grown up in a cult. Specifically the Children of God pedophile sex cult. She was also in the army in intelligence. She has a perspective on cults that absolutely cannot be matched.
According to her, religions CAN'T be cults. But religious GROUPS can.
A religion is a concept and it's too big to ever create the kind of coercive control. Christianity isn't a cult, but Mormons and Catholics are. A Cult requires a shared sacred assumption or charismatic personality to center around.
Cults of personality only last as long as the leader does, and so MAGA is on its way out. Someone may take over the mantle when 47 dies, but MAGA will never be powerful again. Because a cult of personality is specifically about the cult leader. The leader is divine or something like it.
Cults of ideals are built around something that transcends a single person's lifetime. The Army uses the Constitution. Mormons have their weirdly specific rituals and commandments. The Catholic Church has the papacy. Scientology has aliens. The sacred idea is taught and maintained through a bureaucracy of some kind. The leader here is not divine, but a high priest of the divine, so to speak.
A religion is a set of beliefs and values that can be used for good or evil, depending on who has the reins. A small Christian congregation who splits preaching up among the members isn't a cult. A Sikh gurudwara that feeds the locals with volunteers and doesn't require anything from the people eating isn't a cult. A Norse pagan group that meets on the solstices to dance and feast isn't a cult.
A church that tells you to cut off non Christian family members? Cult. A boyfriend who controls who you can see and what you eat and demands domestic labor? That's called a two person cult. A social group that demands all of your free time and punishes you for raising questions? Probably a cult.
A religion is just... it's a D&D rulebook. It tells you what's possible but you make choices within it. A cult is when people use the rule book to extract labor and respurces from people. A cult actively and intentionally exploits people.
The trivialization of cults is a very real part of why we are where we are. If you equate your local minister handing out food and praying for people with Mormon missionaries then you REALLY don't know how dangerously wrong you are. Because you aren't just over stating things with the minister there, you're catastrophically under stating just how fucked up Mormons are. And that doesn't bode well for any of us when it comes to people being able to judge how dangerous things are.
Hey, you're wrong, too! She is NOT the only cult expert who survived/exited a cult. One of the most prominent experts, Janja Lalich, actually exited a cult. Please stop spreading misinformation. There are plenty of cult psychologists who left cults and ended up studying them as a result.
I'm sorry, I misspoke because I didn't edit well enough. She's the only one to grow up in a cult AND to have achieved rank in the army. Her perspective is unique because of that overlap. Well, and her first marriage to a guy she watched go full white supremacist. It's a hell of a combination.
Her being in the army isn't really relevant here lmao
It is since the army is a cult. It's an organized cult that she did intelligence work in. A big part of her work is on why it's absolutely relevant that the army is a cult.
Growing up in a cult gives you a single perspective. Joining one as an adult gives you a different one.
dog, the army is not a cult and I'm not going to argue about it. There are SO many differences between joining the military and joining a cult that I don't have time to go into it at the moment. Are there similarities? Sure. But they're not the same lmao
Her insistence that the army is a cult is the thing she gets attacked for most often so it isn't like it isn't controversial. Not everyone is going to agree, but she makes a very compelling case.
Including the fact that they literally use cult experts to design basic training.
I spent more than half of my life in cults and that doesn't make me an expert, but it does mean I recognized what she wrote about in her books as a mirror to what I grew up around. And she breaks it down in those books in a way I wouldn't care to on Tumblr.
Also, joining the military is just joining a group. There's nothing about it that makes it any different from joining a church or taking a job. The only difference is the scale of the power that it protects and is protected by. Like, it's just joining a group that dictates every detail of your life for years and years, from clothes to medical care to access to information. Definitely hits the BITE model point for point.
