Indie rp / parody ask blog for fun. Writer is 20+. I only write with 18+ (RDR content is mostly mature). Fan made, no profit. I AM NOT AI! You can specify to which John you're sending the ask (1899 RDR2, 1907 RDR2 epilogue , 1911 RDR1). This page is also a tribute to Rob Wiethoff.
Asks follow canon. Closed Rps have a parallel universe of their own. Please specify which John you're sending the ask (if you want). Feel free to interact with your rp blog, I accept OCs, I accept AUs.
John's Journal (canon)
John Marston content compendium (masterpost)
Character Analysis - Study (John and Arthur)
Rp Memes
Threads log
RDR1 John (1911+)
Reformed Verse (alive 1911+): John has the immunity Deal after killing Bill and Dutch. Ross vanished for unknown reasons, the government decided to leave him alive to keep New Austin and the region safe from dangerous outlaws, since Marston's name scares most of them away. He loves his peaceful life at Beecher's Hope, but from time to time has to assist the local Law Enforcement in combat. His daughter is alive in this verse.
Epilogue John "James Jim Milton" (between 1899 and 1911)
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Summary: Conflicts with John make you realize he might not be the stupidest member of the gang. cw: ANGST, omg so much angst, pining kind of?, forced proximity (ft. Hosea), more angst, gn reader, only a few uses of "y/n" (im sorry)
A/n: hey divas. So, im very convinced this is kinda bs, but i needed to write something. Gah i love writing and not writing has made me get sloppy. I feel like i can never get john right, which is odd since hes my fave of all time. Anyway, this idea was rolling around in my head and angst is easier for me to brainstorm than anything else, so knock yourselves out π and shout out to all the peers who pressured for me to finish, yall rock
John Marston was an infuriating man.
One minute he was perfectly friendly. The next, he acted as if he hardly knew you. He was a whiny and pathetic son of a bitch, but he was unfortunately handsome.
Infuriating and complicated. Thatβs what he was. How could a man be so competent at robbing and killing, but so clueless about everything else. You hated it. You hated how he had been your best friend. How he had not only left the gang, but left you. How heβd come back with his tail between his legs. How he still wasnβt a good father to Jack. How he always fought with Abigail. How he still caught your glances and how he still treated you as if nothing had changed.
What a stupid man.
Youβd always been a little jealous of Abigail. Heβd chosen herβ¦ sort of. Even now, he chose to argue with her. What you wouldnβt give for a good argument with John Marston. That seemed pretty terrible of you, to wish for attention from a man who clearly had no intentions of being a good partner to anyoneβ¦
Not that you wanted him as one. Heavens no. What a silly idea.
But one real conversationβ¦ like old times. It was a futile hope. Deep down, you knew you cared for him too much. You knew it would never work. Some things werenβt meant to. Maybe not even the gang. Things had been rough lately, and you were contemplating the idea of leaving. Of going north maybe. Of getting out before it was too late. Youβd seen gangs fall apart before and had a feeling the Van der Linde Gang would end messily.
βYou alright?β The calm voice of Hosea Matthews cut through your thoughts.
You looked up from where you were washing the dishes. You were hardly paying attention, the task becoming mindless as you lost yourself in your own mind. Looking at the older man, you shrugged, knowing it was difficult to lie to him.
βDonβt know,β you stated.
Hosea gave a sympathetic laugh. βThatβs usually a good indicator that you arenβt.β He didnβt pry, but gave a knowing blink. Hosea Matthews had a keen talent for knowing what was going on in the camp before most of the other gang members did.
βWould you mind going to town for me?β He asked casually. βThere are some supplies Susan needs. It might be good for you to get out for a little.β He gave a small smile, nodding toward a wagon that was already suspiciously hitched. You raised an eyebrow as Hoseaβs eyes scanned the camp. βMaybe take some muscle with you too. I think we need flour and those bags can be heavyβ¦ Ah!β
You followed his gaze to where he waved at where the lean, and rather grumpy, looking man was walking by. You frowned immediately.
John looked up, seeing the motion of Hoseaβs hand out the corner of his eye.
βWhy, take this strapping young man,β Hosea teased as he waved John Marston over. The younger outlaw frowned, glancing at you before looking back at Hosea. βJohn, youβve been volunteered to help y/n in town.β
John stared in confusion. He didnβt really like being told what to do. He also didnβt like doing chores. And he hated the idea of being forced into a situation alone with the person he was trying to avoid. βIβm kinda busy,β he grumbled. Though he clearly was not busy.
βItβll just be a quick trip,β Hosea insisted as he shooed you toward the wagon. You gave an annoyed huff as you shot a glare at John. He wasnβt looking at you, but he could feel the angry look.
It was not, in fact, a short trip.
The ride there felt too long. Silence stretched between the two outlaws the entire ride into Rhodes. The heavy warmth of the day hung like a wet blanket over the green countryside. Red dust swirled in the air as the hot wind swept through the trees.
You had retrieved the supplies fairly quickly, but John was being stubborn. He hardly helped, only leaning against the wagon and picking at his nails with his knife.
"A little help?" You asked with an annoyed huff after you placed a heavy sack of flour in the back of the wagon.
John looked up, his dark eyes rolling as he huffed. "You seem to be doing just fine." The man reluctantly lifted a much lighter looking crate and walked slowly to the back of the wagon before pushing it in. You rolled your eyes back, grumbling that he should have just stayed at camp.
Your time in town lasted longer than it should have. After you finished loading the wagon, you looked around, unsurprised to see that John was missing. "That bastard," you huffed. You spent near twenty minutes wandering around before you found him nursing a beer behind the parlor house. You had been worried that something might have happened to him, but of course he had run off for a drink. It made you feel silly for getting anxious about losing him. "The hell are you doing?" You interrogated, snatching the bottle away from him. A frown quickly set itself on his face. "You don't just go off without saying so."
"You ain't in charge of me," John wheezed in annoyance.
Even his voice was irritating. You glared, grabbing his arm to drag him back to the wagon. "Let's just go," you muttered. It was much too hot for this. Whatever peace Hosea though could be made between the two of you was a futile hope, seeing as you didn't really want to be on good terms with him at the moment.
As the wagon rocked out of town, you could only fume at how difficult John was. He was being intentionally irritating, you could tell. You'd known him well enough to understand what his dramatic huffs and snarky tone meant.
"You're being a real pain in the ass," you stated, hating the silence more than you hated the man.
John glanced at you, his eyes narrowing. He didn't understand why you were so angry. It was clear that whatever had been between you two was long dead. He was just trying to move past it... Sort of. Watching you pull away had felt like betrayal to him. So he pulled back. He was angry at how self-righteous you acted... as if he hadn't been hurt too.
"Yeah, well, the feeling is mutual."
How dare he? You turned to glare harshly. You thought it was pretty childish of him to act like this was all somehow your fault. He was the one who left. Before sound could make its way past your lips, a loud snap sent the wagon jolting to the side. You rocked forward onto John before the wagon finally sank into place.
Pulling back quickly, you blinked in embarrassment. You felt your face heat up and you quickly jumped down to assess the damage. A broken wheel. Great.
Just was this day needed.
"Lift!" John growled.
"I am lifting!" You shot back.
You'd been stuck on the side of the road for close to an hour now, trying to fix the wheel. It was nearing dark. You had thought about riding into town, or back to camp for help, but with night approaching, it didn't seem very safe to be wandering. But it also didn't seem safe to stay on the side of the road.
"How hard can it be to fix one damn wheel?" You snapped at him as he stared at the now splintered wheel from the failed attempt at returning it to its place.
John huffed. "Well, it'd be easier without all your incessant yapping."
"Oh, don't blame your incompetence on me." You crossed your arms. "I don't think I've ever met a more stupid man in my whole life."
The outlaw's ears and cheeks turned a bright pink. He looked pissed... and a little pathetic. It had become common place for him to be the butt of jokes and taunts. He knew he probably deserved it after all the shit he had pulled, but he guessed he'd long since attoned for that sin.
"Ain't my fault it's broken," he stated, his teeth grinding together like stones.
"Sure. Always shifting the blame. Have you ever taken responsibility once in your life? Have you ever sucked it up and just did what needed doin' instead of acting like some useless bastard?" Deep down, you knew it was unfair to blame him entirely. But all that anger from before had finally found an outlet.
John moved close to you, unable to contain his anger any longer. "Call me useless again and I'll put a bullet through your skull."
Your lip curled in disgust before you swung your fist. John stumbled back. His eyes flashed as he spun around, tackling you to the ground. It was probably a pathetic sight, two grown outlaws fighting like children. You pushed at his chets, and he tried to wrangle your hands.
"Get off me, jackass!" You yelled.
Grabbing hold of your wrists, John pinned them forcefully to the ground above your head. A terrifying smirk crossed his lips. He was mad. He was insecure. He was confused and tired and... well, John didn't know what to feel about anything anymore. "Thought you liked me on you," he taunted.
Your mind stuttered in an embarrassed shock. Blood pounded in your ears as you tried to fight him. "Shut the hell up."
It was stupid. Utterly stupid, how you could be so angry at him and still find your heart fluttering at the sight of him. Your eyes flashed, betraying you. The orange light of the sunset was dimming as darkness continued to approach. For a long moment, the two of you just stared at one another.
A realization hit you both.
That this would never work. That it was all too little too late. You both had been hurt. And now you both had to deal with the consequences of your actions. John's year away, and the weight of responsibility over a family landed heavily on his shoulders. And you knew there was no room for you in it. Maybe that's why you had been angry.
That he, even if unintentionally, had chosen something else over you.
"Marstonβ"
"Don't," John said. He wasn't a man for sappy words. And as stupid as he was... he'd been fooling himself the whole time. Pretending to be dumb was easier than facing the truth. But he was running out of time. Hiding wasn't a luxury he could afford anymore. Pulling back, John stood before turning toward the broken wheel. "I'll ride to camp," he said, unhitching one of the horses. "Should be back soon."
You watched as he rode off.
Letting yourself lay back in the grass for a moment, you let out a long breath. It was pointless to deny now. Things were changing. And holding onto the past was only hurting the both of you.
It was late before you had finally made it back to camp. Hosea had brought a new wagon with John in tow. Between the three of you, you transferred the supplies and managed to secure the broken wagon to the back of the good one to drag it back to camp.
The ride was quiet, but not with the angst from before. There was a new sadness in the air. Hosea glanced between John, who rode ahead and you.
"Sorry this took longer than expected," he offered. "I guess that's what I get for tryin' to fix somethin' that won't be."
A sting of guilt pierced your chest. "Don't be sorry," you stated, almost flatly. "It's not your fault. It's not anyones..." The words sank into your heart. Perhaps you'd been looking at it all wrong. There was little fault to be placed on anyone. Blame was just an excuse for you to be mad at a situation. Yes, John had done wrong. But the more you thought about it, the more you realized he was probably just as terrified as you were.
"I'm leaving," you said quietly to the older man. "The past... well, the past should stay in the past." You gave a sigh. "There's different futures for the both of us. Ain't no one to blame but life... Sometimes people stay together for forever. And sometimes they don't."
Hosea glanced at you. "That sounds pretty wise... and pretty lonely." He gave a sympathetic look. "Just take care of yourself, alright?" You nodded a promise.
The camp was asleep. The wagons were left for the morning, no one wanted to deal with them anymore. You didn't look at John as you moved to your tent, quickly packing up what little you had. It was a sobering thought that you'd probably never see any of the gang again. They'd been your family... sort of. You grabbed a couple cans of beans before slinging your satchel around your shoulders and hoisting up your saddle bags. As you started toward your horse, you spotted John by one of the fires.
You were surprised he hadn't gone to bed.
The orange glow around him reminded you of a summer that seemed a century ago. A hot and reckless one when you were both stupid enough to start this whole secret fiasco between the two of you. Looking at him, for what may be the last time, you realize how much you did still care about him.
Guess we're still both pretty stupid.
His eyes glanced up at you as you secured the saddle of your horse.
"You leavin?" He asked simply. He didn't really need an answer.
You paused, turning but not looking at him. "Yeah. I am."
The silence was heavy. John felt his heart do a strange flip, like he was losing something he only just realized he had. You stared at your boots. "I'm sorry," you said, your voice more gentle now that all the anger had fizzled from your bones. "For what I said earlierβ"
"Don't be," he cut in. "You were right."
His admission was shocking. You looked up at him, with a hope you knew was fleeting. Even now, you still cared. Because of course you did.
"Be well, y/n," he offered. It wasn't an apology. It wasn't a promise. But it was all he really knew how to give.
Your heart sank to your toes again.
"You too, John."
Turning, dust kicked up behind your boots. You didn't know where you'd go. Or what you would do. But you knew you'd always care. You knew you'd think about him on lonely nights, if he was okay, if he had ever changed. You knew by the time you'd be over him, you would have to change too. Maybe this was for the best.
And maybe, just maybe, if both of you changed enough, fate might see it that you'd meet again. You gave a sigh, knowing that probably wouldn't happen.
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// tbh, i think all that's really needed to 'fix' John's characterisation in ch1-3 would be just to actually write him as on the fence, like instead of "noo i don't wanna even exist near my family" i think him being like hesitant to interact, but maybe still subtly looking out for them and tryna make sure their needs are met could work? But not fully commited. Which also makes Arthur's line abt not tryna be 2 people at once actually make sense...
I don't think a love triangle is necessary tbh, ik there's the journal entry where Arthur says he should've married Abigail but personally i see that as moreso bcse he was sort of in a fatherly role for Jack due to John being a deadbeat than anything else
Regarding Arthur making fun of John, that's kinda a combo of just sibling behaviour, resentment from John not commiting to his family, and some resentment from John being Dutch's "favourite", which i think actually works in context with Dutch's manipulations, both giving him 'favouritism' which might cause resentment from others + acting like John is dumb so his words and ideas are less credible, which is important in the story bcse he was one of the first to question Dutch, which Dutch hates, like that ch3 interaction at the edge of camp where Dutch uses a sorta threatening tone when John doesn't instantly agree with him
Yes, the love triangle wouldn't be a need, and not in the "wanna date Abigail" sense, but more like "gonna father this family" sense. Because Abigail was definitely Arthur's family too, in the sense they were friends for a very long time, at least 5 years.
Yes, making John insecure and hesitant would make a lot more sense than him being toxic and explosive. Yes, John is trying to act "gangster" to feel he belongs and get more approval from the others, but everyone treats him like trash anyways, and in some camp dialogues, like the one with Hosea, he tells John to stop acting stupid. And "ACTING" indeed because the moment Micah teases hitting on Abigail, John gets really mad, the moment Micah threatens to scare Jack, he also gets really mad and when Jack gets kidnapped, John turns feral, and he gets absolutely mad at how Jack talks nice things about Bronte, about the pasta and stuff, realizing how a shitty dad he was.
And like, for that to work, John didn't need to be aggressive or stupid at them. John trying to give them a good meal or a better structure/tent and failing because they're in a gang and need to keep running away or sharing or getting stolen makes more sense than John not giving a shit.
And I'll be real honest now. When I say it's not John's profile to go to near the fire and say a bunch of shit and abandon his family or be stupid to Abigail, I mean it from heart, because my own father already hit me, already yelled at me a lot, humiliated me, called me shit and a lot of stuff, and John never did that to Abby or Jack, not even if the worst moments. He never hit them or yelled at them saying they're a piece of shit. At the point John and Abigail are arguing at the camp, it's more about him asking what he should do about Jack, how to be a father and Abigail being mad at him for not knowing basically. John is rude when he's hurt or angry in the first chapters, but he learns to be more polite and control the way he speaks once Abigail calls him out.
The little camp events when Abigail asks Arthur for money, it gives the impression John doesn't share anything with them, and that also hits very out of character. It would make more sense if what John was sharing was not enough, and at some moments you can see John sharing things and bringing Jack or Abigail stuff (I don't remember if both or one of them).
The game also seems to forget to mention John grew up like a street dog basically, he wasn't educated, didn't live in society. All he knows was taught by Dutch, so he really is clueless about what to do. The game could have highlighted that better. Him asking Arthur or Hosea what he should do. Him trying to take something to Abigail and she throwing it away or at his face because it's not useful at the moment, like him finding flowers when they need food, or bringing some winter dress while it's actually really hot.
About John, to me, it always seemed like his issue is "not belonging" and not "being an ass to people".
John wanted to find a place with people he could love and would love him back. In the epilogue when Sadie and Charles leave, he says he wished the house stayed more full. He's pretty much like a wolf, he wants people and warmth and somewhere cozy and he was always denied that.
John is one of the few characters who REALLY had no choice in life. He literally would have died or lived being abused in all sorts of ways if he didn't run from the orphanage or if he didn't shot the guy who wanted to harm/abuse him on the streets. He also couldn't leave the gang in his younger days or he'd just starve or end up killed.
The moment he could leave, he did but couldn't survive without Jack and Abigail, he couldn't really abandon his family.
Cowboy Jesus? Me of all people? If you hit my face I'll shoot you in the head instead of giving the other side I meanβ You can compare me to Robin Hood if you force things A LOT but....Jesus?
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// regarding that post with the discrepancies with RDR1 vs RDR2 John, with the topic of him and his family specifically, there are some lines in RDR1 suggesting he was mildy crappy (saying how he hadn't always been the best father to Jack), plus in RDR2 Arthur's journal entry from before Blackwater says something about John not being able to "decide if he wants to be a father or not", but this feels at odds with ch 1-3 John if ykwim? Like it suggests him being on the fence/hesitant/maybe a bit shitty, which would be in line with what we heard abt it from RDR1, but his actual characterisation in ch1-3 feels nothing like that, yk?
Idk it's something that kinda annoys me to with how John was written as like, super super shitty... π tin foil hat moment but it does sorta feel like they made John extra awful to try and endear players to Arthur more, even though Arthur's already great?
Yes I agree.
RDR2 is too "late" for John to be an absolute ass.
RDR1 he's 38
RDR2 chapters he's 26, Jack was already 4. Epilogue he's 34 and he's already a good father. Being chased by bounty hunters who found out who he was and protecting Abigail from a potential grapist was not wrong. Rescuing Uncle from being burned alive and killing the psychopath gangs camping near where Abigail wanted to live with Jack seems quite reasonable.
If they wanted to show John having parental crisis, it would make more sense if it happened when Jack was born. We would need to have John's past and traumas more explored, would be nice if they showed how Abigail and John met and not just put some random fragments in some camp events.
We do know John wanted to deny being a father was because he was afraid to be awful, because he didn't want Abby and Jack to be linked with someone like him, because he hates himself and thinks Jack would hate him too. He's also afraid he would be a bad father because his father was a bad father. John wrote in his diary he would abandon himself if he could.
None of that JUSTIFIES him leaving his family or treating them badly of course, but it helps the player understand the complexity of the character.
A guy abandoning his family because he simply doesn't give a fuck is totally different from a guy thinking they deserve someone better to fill that role or panicking and being too scared because he hates himself and wouldn't want himself near the people he loves.
Yes both are bad, but one is a sociopath and the other is a lost man who cares too much and doesn't know what to do.
Let's say many ideas and concepts in RDR2 were very good but were not executed so right.
Abigail love triangle with Arthur and John? KEEP IT. Let the angst happen.
Arthur's son Isaac dying in Colter? Keep it
Flashback of John and Arthur parents being awful to them? Keep it.
John panicking, crying, having nightmares, remembering all the things he suffered because of his father, all the neglect, him trying to do things right and failing, KEEP IT!
They did keep that in the epilogue and it worked so well.
What hits me really hard is that the impression I get is that Rockstar DIDN'T MEAN to make John seem totally awful, but they left the NUANCE and the SUBTEXT too hidden in game events and details that are often missed.
Like John risking to get shot to save Jack in Shady Belle, John getting arrested at the bank BECAUSE HE WENT TO THE POLICE THINKING ABIGAIL HAD BEEN ARRESTED, John being shot at Blackwater mention?? John being shot at the train being rushed, John BEING IN JAIL FOR DAYS, the things he might have been through there??
It's like everything that gives John a good image is in the shadows and everything that makes him sound bad is highlighter.
The train heist mission was a good exemple.
The idea was genius. It was John's idea. If you as Arthur doesn't get the mission materials, John gets it for you. John also explains that's the best way so people don't have to get shot, in the sense John doesn't want to hurt anyone, he just wants to execute the plan to steal the money for Dutch.
And then Arthur makes fun of John and does the main thing in the robbery, so to the player, sounds like John is an absolute useless idiot and Arthur is the big star.
The same with the sheep mission. It was a good non violent mission, a way to make money without hurting people, and Arthur just makes fun on him