Blue Iris by Mary Oliver / Quondam et Futurus / Excalibur 1981 / Doctor Zhivago by Boris Pasternak / Helen by Euripides / A Shirt Made of Fire by Vardges Petrosyan / Tongues & Teeth by The Crane Wives / If You Stare Into a Mirror Long Enough, Strange Things Will Happen / Self-Portrait by Someone Else by Courtney Kampa / Slay the Princess / Vulgate Cycle / Sharp Objects by Gillian Flynn / The Marriage of King Arthur & Queen Guinevere by John Henry Frederick Bacon / Guinevere by William de Leftwich Dodge / Other Side of Paradise by Glass Animals / The DoppelgÀnger by P. Wish / In Two by Nine Inch Nails / Black Swan 2010 / Odette & Odile / possibly Dostoevsky / Lancelot du Lac 1974 / Lancelot du Lac 1970 / esotericbadbitch / Poem Without a Hero by Anna Akhmatova
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truly not sure whatâs funniest here: 1) king arthur instituting a public holiday to celebrate the famous courtly lovers who have been writing to his wife for personal advice on having an affair 2) guinevere enthusiastically telling arthur about how iseult left her husband the king to have an affair with the hot young knight in her court 3) the fact that the celebration arthur creates is on MAY DAY. HELLO.
arthur: damn everyone seems sad as fuck every may about those infants i killed. maybe to cheer everyone up we can have a big party celebrating adultery. hey lancelot do you think that would work
i like how tristan keeps beating the shit out of every knight he runs into and afterwards theyâre always like dude that was awesome, where are you from?? and when he tells them cornwall their reaction immediately changes. theyâre like to i canât fucking believe i got my ass handed to me by some guy from cornwall. im selling my house. never speak to me again
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I am going to make some one sided Hera x Aphrodite propaganda because even tho I praise Aphrodite's emotionally manipulative schemes her brain kinda short circuits whenever Hera asks her something
In the Argonautica Aphrodite was hurt for 1 millisecond before giving in Hera and Athena's request. Hera also holds her hand and gives her parenting advise...
-THE ILIAD BOOK 14, TRANSLATED BY A. T. MURRAY
"Yes queen, whatever you say queen"-Aphrodite
Hera didn't even had to bribe Aphrodite for her to help her. Aphrodite folded so quickly. Girl you two are fighting in opposites sides of the war, Hera literally helped the guy that stabbed you, can't you see she will sleep with Zeus to help the Achaeans?
-AENEID BOOK 4, TRANSLATED BY H. R. FAIRCLOUGH
This one is the most baffling to me. WHY VENUS WHY! Goodness sake, if you know Juno is manipulating you why are you walking straight into her trap? Go help your son get to Italy! Is Juno saying "Let's us rule these people together" enough for you to forget she was hunting your son down just a few seconds ago??
(Anyways this post is more humorous then anything, don't take it seriously)
Another version of Adonisâ death: Persephone crucified him
âA myrtle-tree is chosen [to hang Cupid], well known in that sad grove and hateful from the vengeance of the gods. Thereon had Proserpine, once slighted, tormented Adonis, mindful of his Venus.â
Actually the WORST thing to come out of the new Odyssey movie is that people are going to spread blatant misinformation on how nuanced mythology is. I have already seen multiple asks/posts about how "Helen was brainwashed by Aphrodite" like okay thank you for solving decades long debate on Helen's autonomy in one tumblr post but we literally do not have a singular conclusion on that.
Just curious but where does the star on cheek motif come from in Ancient Greece? Itâs beautiful but I donât know what itâs called so I canât google it effectively and âstar on cheek ancient Greeceâ did not net me much. If you have any resources on this I would love to read them!
I'm not sure if there's an actual term for it, but the main (and perhaps only) point of reference that everyone seems to use is this painted plaster head of a woman from Mycenae c. 12th century BCE (National Archaeological Museum Athens inv. 4575). it's a unique and pretty unusual object for the period, but apparently there are a couple of other (less well-preserved or less impressive) examples of women's faces depicted with these red suns/stars/rosettes on their cheeks and chins in Mycenaean art. there's some thought that it might be a representation of some sort of makeup worn by real women in late Bronze Age Mycenae, potentially royalty and/or priestesses in official ritual contexts. alternatively it could be an artistic marker of divinity or non-human status with absolutely no relation to women's appearances in real life, since this head may have belonged to a statue of a goddess or a sphinx. we do have a decent number of Mycenaean wall painting fragments depicting female figures, and I don't believe any of them have these markings on their faces-- the trend of depicting mythic or historical Bronze Age Greek women like this really does seem to all come back to this one object.
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really & truly the only thing we know about odysseus' war prize as mentioned in the iliad is that... there is one, and it's probable that she would be an enslaved concubine comparable to chryseis and briseis, since that is the context in which agamemnon mentions potentially taking odysseus' prize as compensation. that's it. as far as i'm concerned (and no one is forcing you to listen to me) anyone has room to headcanon whatever they want.
however. sleeping with slaves was not a crime or a taboo; it was normative, normalized, and encouraged. the text may leave details out, and sometimes we are more comfortable with characters for whom it is easier to ignore certain aspects of their context that aren't front and center. but absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, especially when you ask yourself: what would the intended readers of the iliad have assumed about the purpose of this character, who isn't named, who is barely touched on, except as a substitute for another enslaved concubine? exceptional cases are often noted: agamemnon explicitly saying he didn't touch briseis, for example, or the odyssey's detail that laërtes never slept with eurycleia. but how laërtes behaved doesn't prove shit about what odysseus did or didn't do during a war. they are different people in different circumstances.
you can use that to build a headcanon all you want. but you're coping, and you have to know you're coping.
This assumption that certain characters are somehow exempt of owning slaves with all the consequences that entails is admittedly morbidly fascinating to me, given how often female slaves are given as "gifts" or prizes in the Iliad. It's frequently enough that their mentions are almost fully formulaic, all "and I will give x tripods untouched by fire, x talents of gold, x shimmering basins and so and so many women experienced in skillful works ..." It's so very, very nomalized that you would need a very good argument for why somebody *doesn't* follow that cultural norm.
you can't understand just how compelling i find achilles' spiraling in the iliad even before patroclus dies. he's not just sitting in his tent pouting and unchanging, he's so dedicated to his own bitterness and hurt he's making himself mentally deteriorate to the point where he's making demands that have already been offered (wishing agamemnon would just offer briseis back, with gifts, which happened six books prior) and losing himself in post-apocalyptic fantasies. ooh book 15 achilles is doing sooo bad mentally and shows how desperately something needs to change (and it will very shortly with patroclus' death)
if you can't handle achilles at his "i can't wait until every trojan and achaean are dead and it's just you and me, patroclus" you don't deserve him at his aristos achaion
finally started violence and the sacred by rene girard and he's talking about the essential characteristics of sacrificial victims and how they can't be properly integrated into society and should be incapable of exacting revenge and
agamemnon brainworms activated iphigeneia is a child and not yet fully a bride and so has no clear active role in society yet, and she is the commander/sacrificer's own child, so killing her in sacrifice will cause no further vengeance. he did it to himself/his own progeny, so who's gonna avenge her? it was culturally/socially consensual!
BUT WHAT'S THAT? ITS QUEEN CLYTAEMNESTRA WITH A STEEL CHAIR AXE
The thing is I actually do mostly enjoy Epic for what it is but if youâre going to make all these complaints about Nolanâs Odyssey as an adaptation then turn around and praise Epic I am gonna laugh a bit
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SAY NO MORE. everyone sit down, grab a drink, and listen to what i like to refer to as "hey what the fuck are we even doing." i will preface this with 4 statements:
I am a terminal hater. I view every claim made in an academic publication with a suspicious squint, which probably influenced my dissertation significantly and definitely influenced my outlook on Attic Late Geometric (henceforth called LG) pottery.
I am specifically a terminal hater of periodization. I love continuity. I love observing the integration of old and new as things gradually change over time. I do not like cutting time up into âneat little boxesâ which end up simplifying gradual processes into sharp breaks. I am also already a bit of a hater of Early Iron Age Greek chronology. I would kill Submycenaean in a heartbeat, I think itâs stupid as hell (shoutout Papadopoulos et al 2013 btw). So I am even more predisposed to be skeptical here.
I especially hate the idea of definitive statements being applied to a protohistoric period & region like, say, Early Iron Age Attica. like man i think it depends
Either everyone else has been using a totally separate mindset here which I am incapable of having towards pottery analysis or perhaps they've been smoking crack in a corner for almost a hundred years, its really uncertain. Either way this is literally just me. I have tried to find someone else with this specific critique. Nope. Its Just Me. so take that for what you will.
Anyways, here is my beef with the Standard Approach To Late Geometric Attic Pottery Chronology & Development (Abridged) (This was an 8000 word undergraduate dissertation):
So, background context for those of you not emotionally invested in Ancient Greek Pottery Lore - THIS is the standard [big-picture] chronology of Attic Geometric Pottery (from Coldstream 2008, "Greek Geometric Pottery"):
Ignore the top bit (Proto-Attic/PA), he ain't relevant (sorry proto-attic stans). What REALLY matters here is my buddy the Late Geometric - LG I and LG II and all variants therein (LGIa, LGIb, etc). This is the one which I will focus on today, for I find the way it's been framed to be total, utter bullshit.
You may be wondering "how is this utter bullshit? it looks fine!" Well. Well. For that I must backtrack a little to first discuss the Average Approach To Studying Ancient Pots. Due to multiple factors - especially antiquities trafficking, loss of in-situ contexts, antiquarianism - the Pot People have been molded into a strange lovechild between archaeology and art history. Which means that the analysis of pottery production, and of specific vessels is less about where they were found and more about their shape and decoration [ie, if its a fuckin skyphos or not + how Achilles was painted on it]. This isnât the only way that ancient ceramics are analyzed - thereâs also other indicators such as the clay used to make them (which is very useful for pinning its original production site to a particular geographic region, since the chemical composition of clay can be pretty confidently localized) and inscriptions/writing (ie, signatures by the artisan(s) or the usage of regional alphabets). But figural decoration remains the primary focal points for scholarship centered on Athenian pottery, and influences so much of how Attic vessels are analyzed in comparison to one another and how ancient Greek ceramic production is discussed as a whole.
Which, in my humble opinion, is an absolutely fucking absurd way to conceptualize Late Geometric pottery workshops. Athenian workshops in the later Archaic period were centralized around the potters, not painters (Sapirstein 2013, 499-500); a theory that is further supported by the presence of faint inscriptions on red-figure pottery (made before firing) which delineate the position & identity of the figures depicted on the vase (Iozzo, 2018). And while I am hesitant to apply a later organization of production to what is, again, a protohistorical period with no written records, I find it far more plausible to center the production of ceramics around the potters, who are making the fucking vases here, rather than Davison & Coldstreamâs focus on painters - who are fulfilling a secondary, and ultimately more specialized/individualized role in the process. Especially since painters in Archaic Athens were also not restricted to a particular workshop (Sapirstein 2014, p. 180-181), so the conception that painters were trained in the kind of centralized way that Davison & Coldstream are theorizing here (moreso Coldstream, Davisonâs actually kinda flexible re: workshop organization) seems improbable. Regardless, basing the chronological sequence of vessels according to their decoration alone (in my opinion) seems far less useful than the potential route of how these vases were created.
For example, there was an incredibly interesting study semi-recently which analyzed the proportions of skyphoi cups from the Early Geometric through the LG (Smyrnaios 2017). The reason I find it so fascinating - and so useful as an approach to LG workshops - is because the study noted a consistency in these ratios, generally consistent changes in these ratios over time, and - in the case of two specific Late Geometric skyphoi - there was a clear break from the predominant pattern in favor of a different ratio which was used for only them!! (Smyrnaios 2017, p. 119). This (in my opinion) is WAY MORE useful for the reconstruction of a protohistoric workshop, because you can draw a clear, distinct contrast between how they were produced and the other studied examples. While this is not necessarily definitive in a chronological sense (maybe if you could pinpoint specific transitions in the ratio? but I digress), itâs still (again, in my opinion) far more useful than the predominant focus on the style of the painted decoration. Thereâs also another interesting study re: wheel-made vs. hand-made Protogeometric pottery (ca. 1000-900BCE) that proposes that differences in production methods were connected to who/where/how an individual potter was trained (RĂŒckl & Jacobs, 2016). Thereâs so much more potential here re: ceramic production and its just being Ignored (well. Smyrnaios is pretty invested but overall this is a very niche area).
Now, going back to Davisonâs graph, you may notice something a bit strange about the chronology of Late Geometric workshops. The style itself - and the entire period - is defined by the Dipylon Workshop - and, more specifically, the painter referred to as the âDipylon Masterâ (who, judging by Coldstream 2008, p. 33-35 is maybe also thought of as a potter? but I'll get to that).
You may or may not know the Dipylon Workshop from such hits as:
Athens 804, aka âThe Dipylon Amphoraâ[3], and my buddy Athens 192, aka the 'Dipylon Oinochoe.' There's lots of amphorai and oinochoai out there in the world so to me they are simply A804 and A192.
But again, Iâm a skeptical bastard. So I got curious. What was the evidence behind this? Who came up with this theory? Where did it come from?
Everyone (Brann 1960, p. 12) (Coldstream 2008, 3) (Davison 1961, p. 6, 23-24) (CouliĂš 2015, p. 39) kept pointing back to an article by G. Nottbohm as the first to really define the 'Dipylon Master,' describe his style, and attribute works to him. So I go look for Nottbohmâs article. and. oh my god stop the fucking train okay
This ^^ is the foundation for how scholarship compares Late Geometric Attic pottery workshops and positions their development. This fuckass article that positions the âDipylon Masterâ[4] as the âfirst tangible artist on European soilâ who âbreaks through the darkness of the preceding centuriesâ and is âone of the greatest manifestations of the Greek spirit and Greek art of all time.â like. can we all set aside all the decorative analysis this field's been obsessed with for 100+ years and unpack this? like, her framing of the âDipylon Master,â the fact that she even fucking calls him «Der Meister der Grossen Dipylon-Amphora», and the field all just adopted that shit too for some fucking reason, just. All of it. Chuck it in the bin for now guys. Please. or. no? weâll just speculate abt which Middle Geometric workshop the âDipylon Masterâ came from (Bohen 2017, p. 160-162)? đ« đ« đ« đ« please the racism & facism is right fucking there like am i HIGH?
And Nottbohmâs methodology has been critically reviewed only once - by Chamoux (1945), who was also afaik the first one to actually respond to the article - but⊠he doesnât address the ideological bend to it that taints her methodology? He does make some very good points [5] that honestly just look like he got hit by Apollo's dodgeball, where he's like "Nottbohm's terminology will only encourage people to recreate an artist's personality which is ultimately unverifiable, surely we could be doing something better with our time" (Chamoux 1945, p. 68) (i'm paraphrasing & it's all in french). unfortunately he got proven right and this field refuses to do a u-turn. Chamoux why'd you have to focus on other shit besides Geometric pottery please you were the only one[6] on the right track,,,,
Anyways thatâs my take on Late Geometric pottery chronology, development & workshops đ i hate the "dipylon master founded it all and was First" idea and i dont give a shit if killing it nukes our current chronological dating of the LG because i think the theory should Die
---
[1.] The reason I consider Geometric pottery as "objectively one of the hardest styles to define a definitive workshop using only figural decoration" is because Geometric art is - as I've noted above - kinda sparse with figural decoration? And when it does appear, it's very linear & abstract. So emphasizing the decoration here, and treating it like definitive proof of a shared producer for two vases, is just. Bizzare to me.
[2.] This is not a dig at the LG style here - I think it fucks severely. My main concern is that so many attempts to categorize LG vessels seem to ignore this element of abstraction altogether - or, worse, treat divergences from it as âa mistakeâ (Moore 2007, p. 18), a âcollapseâ/disintegration (Coldstream 2008, p. 56), or âdegenerativeâ (Brann 1962, 15). This kind of thinking appears in tandem with the concept of Attic(cough Athenian cough) pottery being influenced by Corinth (Coldstream 2008, 56); take from that what you will.
[3.] rip to every other amphora from the hieraian gate cemetery ifg. only One Dipylon Amphora allowed
[4.] the quotation marks i have been using this whole time have been to convey just how much i fucking despise this name and all its shitass loaded baggage that it carries. this is quite an aggressive way to say this now that i think abt it but still im a Hater
[5.] Not including the bit where he tries to use LG battle scenes to date the Iliad. Not touching that with a ten-foot pole. I only care for his critique of Nottbohm â€ïž
[6.] this is technically an overexaggeration, Siebert 2010 (p. 311) kinda took up the torch on this one (calling Nottbohm's methodology inadequate lmao) but. i fear its like a tiny corner of french scholarship and the anglophones need to catch the hell up ASAP.
========================================
Sources/Further Reading:
Nottbohm, G.G. (1943) âDer Meister Der Grossen Amphora Im Dipylon,â JdI 58, pp. 1â31.
Kahane, P. (1940) âDie Entwicklungsphasen der Attisch-Geometrischen Keramik,â American Journal of Archaeology, 44(4), pp. 464â482. Available at: https://doi.org/10.2307/499959.
Brann, E.T.H. (1962) Late Geometric and Protoattic Pottery: Mid 8th to Late 7th Century B.C. (The Athenian Agora). Available at: https://doi.org/10.2307/3601969.
Ć tÄpĂĄn RĂŒckl and Loe Jacobs (2016) ââWith a Little Help from My Wheelâ: Wheel-Coiled Pottery in Protogeometric Greece,â Hesperia: The Journal of the American School of Classical Studies at Athens, 85(2), p. 297. Available at: https://doi.org/10.2972/hesperia.85.2.0297.
Iozzo, M. (2018) âHidden Inscriptions on Athenian Vases,â American Journal of Archaeology, 122(3), pp. 397â410. Available at: https://doi.org/10.3764/aja.122.3.0397.
Sapirstein, P. (2013) âPainters, Potters, and the Scale of the Attic Vase-Painting Industry,â American Journal of Archaeology, 117(4), pp. 493â510. Available at: https://doi.org/10.3764/aja.117.4.0493.
Sapirstein, P. (2014) âDemographics and Productivity in the Ancient Athenian Pottery Industry,â in J.H. Oakley (ed.) Athenian Potters and Painters III: Athenian Potters and Painters III. Oxbow Books, pp. 175â186. Available at: https://doi.org/10.2307/j.ctvh1djzf.
Moore, M.B. (2007) âATHENS 803 AND THE EKPHORA,â Antike Kunst, 50, pp. 9â23.
Whitley, J. (1997) âBeazley as theorist,â Antiquity, 71(271), pp. 40â47. Available at: https://doi.org/10.1017/S0003598X00084520.
Bohen, B. (2017) Kratos & krater: reconstructing an Athenian protohistory. Oxford (GB): Archaeopress Archaeology (Archaeopress archaeology).
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