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Matt, we end every episode of the show by asking filmmakers what's the last great thing they've seen. You are a cinephilic.
Matt: Well, my answer will not match that description at all because I've been going to film festivals for so long and I haven't been able to see movies in the festivals. But—
Do you miss that, being able to watch movies?
Matt: [in an affirmative tone] Oh, my God. Oh, my God. But you know what, I have Toronto, the Toronto Film Festival is just like, a repository of everything.
So you just go and check everything out?
Matt: I just watch everything. I just watch everything. They just play it all at the Scotiabank Theatre and I just watch every single movie. And what's so great is you can just walk out whenever you want, so it's like, if something doesn't catch me I just leave and go to another screening because there's so many thing screening at the same time. I cried watching Dungeons & Dragons.
Really? Tell me about it. I liked it too.
Matt: Oh, yeah?
Yeah.
Matt: Oh, I cried. Like, that movie is a great example of me going in with a huge chip on my shoulder being like, "Yeah, right, this sucks." I didn't like the other films from that group of filmmakers, I found them to be mawkish in a way, and I was expecting the exact same thing here and I was completely captured. I swear it must've been the puppetry.
[laughs]
Matt: Because the film was so tactile and goofy and sweet and it kind of had this PG "Aw, shucks" innocence that—it was—I couldn't judge it. For me to be like, "Oh, this movie is bad" would be like, almost making fun of a really happy kid who's just doing his own thing, and what does that make me look like? I'm gonna watch some kid running around playing a game with his friend and be like, "What an idiot"?
What led you to go see a Dungeons & Dragons film in theatres?
Matt: My good friend, Jay McCarrol, is part of a Dungeons & Dragons group and he was going with his friends and I was like, "I'll come with you." And so we saw a sneak preview, and I'm telling you, at that act three moment, I just cried. I was standing next to my brother, Erik, and just cried. Maybe it's because I played Baldur's Gate, I don't know.
[laughs]
Matt: But like, this movie? I adored it. I adored it. And who knows, on a second watch I may be like, "Ah, you know, this is cold and dead", but I never really watch movies twice, so.
I can't stop thinking about the fact that they completely recreated their apartment they lived in together 15 years later. how very very strange that must of been. and all to film a movie about how much their friendship still means to them. and how they used that recreated space to film a fake behind the scenes video about filming with their younger selves, who still live there.
“we were walking down queen street. it was raining, it was pouring rain, everyone had umbrellas except you and i, and i was so like caught up in the adolescent joy of being on queen street that i was like why do people even have umbrellas? don’t they realize this is just beautiful...” - matt johnson cineplex interview x
“the rain was fat and sticky and almost sweet. It was the kind of rain that feels more warm than wet. The kind that requires no umbrella whatsoever. Bird remembered feeling this way once before, but from a childhood long ago. Or was it a dream? Could life even be this wonderful? Bird was only certain of one thing: he wanted it to rain forever.” - matt and bird break loose episode 2 x
somedays you just gotta accept that they are insane about each other and shake your head and move on. today is not one of those days
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(watching a matt johnson interview) why did he say that. why did he say that. why would he say something like that. what was the purpose in saying that. why did he say that
[ID: An image made up of three frames of the episode "The Buffet" and two passages from The Sacred and Profane Love Machine by Iris Murdoch. The first frame is in colour and shows Jay walking on the street, imitating Wallace Shawn at the Beginning of My Dinner with Andre. The screenshot from the book reads:
Of course Edgar wanted now to keep Monty at Mockingham for ever, and of course he had not said this to Monty, and of course Monty knew and was coming to Mockingham all the same.
The next frame is black and white and shows Jay's "Dear Matt, I'm leaving the band" letter. The screenshot from the book reads:
Edgar finished reading the letter, sat down upon the purple sofa and dropped the sheets of paper on the floor. Monty's final piece of frightfulness. He stared at the window and at the gently moving branches of the wistaria outside and listened to the profound airless silence of the house, and let these representations carry a sense of terrible solitude to his heart. Monty had given him the slip. Had he expected it? Had he really imagined that he and Monty would grow old together at Mockingham? Had it not trembled in his mind with the insecurity of a mirage?
The last frame of the episode is black and white and shows Matt sitting at the table staring ahead after having read Jay's letter. END ID]
[ID: A black and white drawing of Matt and Jay from "The Blindside", dressed up as Luke Skywalker and Han Solo, respectively, although Matt doesn't know he's Luke. A pair of moviegoers say "Omg look at that HAN!" and "Cute couple cosplay" as Jay smiles nervously at them and Matt says "Why thank you! Jay what's your costume? Are you the beautiful warrior princess whom I Han Solo plow?". In the following drawing, Matt has taken Jay by the chin and is attempting to kiss him. He says "C'mon your majesty, let's give em some sugar." Jay says "Matt. No." to which Matt says "Oh, resisting!! True to character." END ID]
[ID: A frame of the episode "The Burger". Matt has written "We kiss" on the whiteboard, wearing a hockey jersey.
A screenshot of The Myth of Sisyphus by Albert Camus. The text reads: "There is a moral to it. It teaches that a man defines himself by his make-believe as well as by his sincere impulses. There is thus a lower key of feelings, inaccessible in the heart but partially disclosed by the acts they imply and the attitudes of mind they assume." END ID]
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reading specters of marx by jacques derrida and simulacra and simulation by jean baudrillard and between men by eve sedgwick and vatican to vegas by norman klein to better understand nirvanna the band the show
Jay: —just for yourself and what you think makes something funny, but you have to think about the audience—oh, look at the nice plane! You have to think of the audience when you're thinking of story, because story is like, univer—
holding back an amused "I love you" after someone makes a really good personal comment or joke is like making the move for your sheathed blade and stopping midway through
as mentioned, i keep circling around this moment from the banned list 2.
Dude, this hat, it's like the Symbiote, black Spider-man. You put it on and then, "That's it, i'm gonna lie to my best friend."
i'm so obsessed with this line. obsessed with the awkwardly over the top delivery (in character) unsuccessfully trying to mask the bubbling emotion underneath, obsessed with the always present threat in the word "b-friend" being called to the forefront, obsessed with the spectre of jay leaving already looming over the whole scene even tho he hasn't said it yet, obsessed with the way matt attempts through this """"""joke"""""" to reframe his emotions and actions as being puppeteered by a foreign object that takes over his body. as if lying to jay in this specific instance is such a distant memory already that it's tantamount to being taken over by an alien parasite that fuels your worst thoughts, and afterwards you wake up covered in black goo with only a vague recollection of what you did.
it always reminds me of what matt said in an interview about the (original) hat:
Matt: When I put [the hat] on for the first episode of that show I was like, "This is it, this is the new me!" In many ways that show is more honest about who I really am than The Dirties is, because in that show I’m just so bellicose and extremely tasteless. That is definitely a different side of my personality, but it is still me, definitely. [source, emphasis mine]
ofc it's not about the hats at all. the costume (camera, scene partner) is just an excuse to act on what's inside that you find difficult or impossible to act on in the real world. i think improv, pro wrestling and comedy are all doing the same thing: they're so performative that they approach a truth that is truer than reality. for the character, the black hat takes his worst fear (singular, because there's really only one) and "makes" matt act on it. for the matt that's wearing this matt like a costume, it says, "it doesn't matter who you think you are, with jay in front of the camera you're gonna find out, warts and all."
the whole ending to s2 is an interesting variation of the ending of the web series, because both endings use fear to talk about love. now, there's 2 ways to take the scene when they're on stage about to have the thing they always wanted in e10 of the web series: you take it as reality, i.e., they are actually getting a gig in some shape or form at the rivoli, or you take it as jay's dream. either way, there is anxiety about forgiveness. that aspect remains irrefutable, i think. in summary, matt (or jay's anxiety about his relationship with matt) essentially says to jay: "you cannot forget the things i did to you to make this happen, and that means you cannot forgive me. but you have to, otherwise i will literally call this off." it's like he said in the basement of vince's house (a dark hidden place similar to the closet of their apartment where things can safely exist in a state of remaining unaddressed): "i'm doing this for us." matt talking about being inspired massively by the character of eric matthews from boy meets world gives more clarity on the theme:
Matt: [...] You can bend the rules, so long as your intention is actually goodness for everybody. [...] And I think that that's something that left a lasting impact on me, and [...] it's why a lot of my work is in some ways..."infantile" would be the negative way to say it, but childlike. Concerned with an adolescent morality formation, where the characters in Nirvanna the Band, The Dirties, in everything, even in BlackBerry, is another great example—like the characters form a morality around the idea that "My intention is the best for you, and so you must forgive my behaviour. Because you have to look beyond it, to see that, yeah, I'm screwing around, and I'm not maybe taking this as seriously as you would like me to, but my intention is actually for you to be"—like, in the episode I bring up, his intention is to get his brother out of trouble. [source, emphasis mine]
idk about you, but when i heard the above for the first time, a lot of things clicked into place. the frantic begging jay to forgive him makes so much sense, and so does a little bit of the meaning of "this" (my honest opinion is that "this" will always remain at least partially elusive, because it's meant to be elusive).
ntb is great because it forces people to confront the question "do you think you are genuine?" sure, matt's also trying to make his emotions smaller, because it's something he does frequently. it was no big deal after all, it's a "solvable problem". "yes, my man." "makes sense". haha can you believe i got so worked up over thinking my plans with you were over that i locked us in on a hot roof because i'd rather roast and be thirsty than even entertain the thought of losing that. but i cannot look at this scene as anything other than the show literally turning to face me and going "this is as real as it gets. they are not coming back from this one for a while". it's fantastic underscoring to that feeling of experiencing a relationship mca in real time that permeates the entire ending. like it literally doesn't matter that it's not "real", happening in front of a camera, planned out at least to some extent. you put on the hat and you're forced to acknowledge yourself, good and bad. getting at a truth that not even they could name.
[ID: Six images, frames of Nirvanna the Band the Show the Movie that feature cutouts of text relaying a poem by OP.
First frame, Matt points at something off-screen on the streets of Toronto. The text reads "and if you've been close to the city's heart you've watched us—"
Second frame, Matt and Jay are walking outside with the back of their blazers stretched out by the parachutes. The text reads "close together, instinctively, about to begin"
Third frame, a closeup of the whiteboard in the old Queen Street apartment, after Jay has erased the "Don't" from "Don't play the Rivoli!". The text reads "On one whiteboard he wrote, I love you"
Fourth frame, 2008 Matt sleeping on the couch with his hat drawn over his face. The text reads "But I was flattened, sleeping and dreaming something grim,"
Fifth frame, Jay at the piano after he has come back from 2008, the empty Orbitz bottle in focus. The text reads, "he told me all this Afterward, often."
Last frame, Matt writing on the whiteboard. The text reads "But I already knew" END ID]
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i think there's a tendency (maybe born of insecurity) to diminish any meaningful response to matt & jay's work and/or their opinions on said work (or their creative process/outlook in general) by adding caveats about how we KNOW it's just ntb/m&j, with the implication being that these are two silly dumbass guys making silly dumbass media and it would be a silly dumbass move to approach it with too much gravitas. but while the silly dumbassery is certainly an undeniable facet of their existence and output, i don't think think it's wholly necessary to undercut any serious analysis (or just a genuine emotional response!) to what they make or what they say about it. just because they're goofy, that doesn't suddenly detract from the obvious passion and thoughtfulness that's integral to so much of what they create. idk i just don't think there's any harm in responding seriously to something they very much take seriously themselves!
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