i am not your answer

You say horrible idea, and I say BRILLIANT idea! This is the exact messiness I’m getting at when I mention the potential problematic scenarios of having numerous traumatized people - with overlapping trauma - all receiving treatment from the same therapist.

To be fair to Jean, he does deserve to talk about his own experiences regarding what Proust did to Andrew (the fact that Riko made him read out the reports of every horrible thing Proust did to Andrew as Riko gloated & took obvious sadistic pleasure in Andrew being raped, similar to how Riko took sadistic pleasure in Jean be raped - I’m also not sure if Nora still intends to include the video tapes she once referenced in the EC, or if she’s toned it down to only being written reports) because frankly Jean as a rape victim, having to read out graphic descriptions of another person being raped and tortured, would be traumatic for Jean. Especially because of how powerless Jean would have felt both in regard to not being able to do anything for Andrew, or for himself, but also the fact that he KNEW why Neil came to Evermore - to protect Andrew - and Jean, while being forced to torture Neil & watch Neil be tortured - would know that Neil's sacrifice was for nothing, but not be able to tell Neil that as well.

Jean has such an interesting way of thinking about Neil & Andrew in the his novels that is so different from how he thinks about other characters, and I think some of that is because of this history between the three of them.

It is something Jean might need to process with his therapist in order to cope with it (and would deserve to do so safely).

And Betsy would have to engage with helping Jean process his own feelings in regard to Proust assaulting Andrew, while having a personal and professional relationship with Andrew. As Jean’s therapist, she cannot shut the conversation down. Nor can she share what Jean told her (without Jean’s permission) with Andrew. Nor can Betsy pretend to be emotionally detached from Andrew when she hears Jean speak about what Proust did to him - we can see how attached Betsy is to Andrew during her Bonus Perspective chapter when she refers to him as her, “most precious charge,” and rushes to him as quickly as possible. However, she would not be able to do that if Jean doesn’t allow her to tell Andrew what he tells her.

If Jean doesn’t give Betsy permission to share her knowledge with Andrew, then Betsy would have to pretend that she doesn’t know while interacting with Andrew. However, despite pretending to his face that she doesn’t know, Betsy cannot force amnesia upon herself every time she interacts with Andrew. Not only would she have knowledge about what Proust did to Andrew, but also all the information Proust gathered about Andrew’s other sexually abusive foster homes & all of Andrew’s triggers regarding the word ‘please’, being tickled, being strangled, being called a ‘whore’, etc.,. And she would know that Andrew isn’t sharing that information with her. And Betsy could only speculate on why Andrew isn’t sharing that information with her: because he doesn’t trust her fully yet, because he’s too traumatized to talk about it - whatever the reason, she wouldn't know.

She also wouldn’t have Andrew's own perspective on anything, only Jean’s account - and Jean’s information would come from Proust, who is the rapist. Not from Andrew, the person who was assaulted.

And Betsy would have to grapple with the fact that she chose Easthaven. That she drove him there. And that Easthaven only added to the institutional abuse Andrew has experienced throughout his life from the foster care system, to the criminal justice system, and now the mental health system. Obviously, Betsy couldn't have known there would be a sadistic doctor at Easthaven willing to take bribes to rape his patients. Andrew needed to be taken off his medication for his own well-being.

Moreover, she might also find out about Neil getting tortured on Andrew’s behalf and that would be another thing Betsy couldn’t address. Neil’s willingness to get hurt on Andrew’s behalf, how Andrew’s feels about that, what it means for their relationship (does Betsy even know that Andrew considers Neil the “something he’s building his life around” because as a therapist Betsy would also have to address the, uh, flaws of making your romantic partner the reason You Aren’t Suicidal).

And if Betsy slipped up at all, Andrew would know that someone out there knows his darkest secrets & is close enough to Betsy to tell her. Andrew is clever, even Betsy trying to subtly press for more information regarding Andrew and his trauma surrounding CSA/SA, or trying out treatment plans that emphasize CSA recovery/SA recovery would be a red flag for him. And he’d be wondering where Betsy got her information from considering even Neil, who knows the most about Andrew’s trauma, doesn’t know as much as Jean was forced to learn from Riko.

And considering everyone knows everyone in regard to who Betsy is treating, it wouldn’t be hard for Andrew to narrow down his options (and then begin violently interrogating THOSE people. This would make Andrew incredibly paranoid & violent considering we know how possessive he is in general and particularly over his secrets). Andrew would grow to distrust even more people - definitely Betsy, which would put a stop to Andrew receiving any therapy & might even throw a wrench in Andrew & Aaron working on bettering their relationship. Andrew didn't have much of a relationship with the Trojans, but he definitely wouldn't be trusting any of them, especially those closest to Jean in case Jean told them, as well. He might even be paranoid about Kevin b/c of how close Kevin is with Jean & what Jean could have told him or even Riko could have told him.

Neil is lucky that he already admitted to knowing about Proust to Andrew, so he'd be saved from Andrew's paranoia, but also Andrew probably wouldn't want Neil interacting with Jean at all b/c of what Jean could tell Neil about Andrew (Neil I think would agree to stop associating with Jean for Andrew. Kevin would not, throwing a wrench into their friendship). Considering Neil also has a LOT of his own paranoia, I feel as if Andrew/Neil could very easily enable one another to be more paranoid/distrust outsiders [hey, here's how Andrew/Neil can become even MORE codependent].

Andrew, I believe, would view Betsy holding this information from him or refusing to divulge where she got this information from to be a personal betrayal. He wouldn’t care if Betsy has a professional obligation to Jean, he would be too appalled at Betsy knowing all of this about him (Betsy, who Andrew didn’t even want to tell that he was gay/in a relationship with Neil to. Who Andrew never admitted his CSA to in the first place & Betsy only found out post-Thanksgiving alongside everyone else) as well as Betsy trying to hide the information from Andrew - Andrew who detests liars, who hated Neil lying to him/hiding shit from him when Neil didn’t even know him, hated Kevin hiding shit from him - especially considering Nora said that Neil sharing Andrew’s secrets & belittling them would be the only thing Neil could do that would cause Andrew to lose faith in him. I don’t think Jean giving Betsy permission to share what he said with Andrew (like how Kevin gave Betsy permission to share what he said with Jean) would help matters. Andrew would not only be furious with Jean for knowing this information in the first place - even if it wasn’t Jean’s intent to ever know & he is extremely uncomfortable WITH knowing - it wouldn’t make a difference to Andrew. Andrew is okay invading other people’s privacy but as soon as someone does anything like that to him he is absolutely furious (Andrew’s locked door isn’t other people’s locked doors, etc.,). And he would be even more furious that Jean “blabbed” what he would view as his personal information to BETSY - who is meant to be Andrews.

He would resent Jean for ruining his relationship with Betsy (he may not distrust Betsy as much as if Betsy had kept the information hidden, but I think he would definitely feel uncomfortable around her, especially if she tried to push him into talking about Proust/anything else she had learned - Andrew, too, wouldn't be able to forget Betsy suddenly knowing all of his secrets without Andrew ever having said a word about them) while also resenting Jean for knowing literally all of his weaknesses. How he reacts when he’s called A.J., how to get him to say say please, every humiliating and terrible thing Proust did to him & not to mention everything Riko dug up about his previous foster homes.

I don’t think he would trust Jean to keep this information to himself - because Jean had already told one person, how can Andrew stop him from telling more people? - nor is his relationship close enough for Andrew to even want Jean to know. This isn’t everyone knowing about Drake - who Andrew also didn't want anyone to know about - or what little he told Neil about why he hates the word please from when he was 7, or why he hates the word misunderstanding & Luther. This is everything. All torn open for Jean to know & possibly use against him (not that Jean would, but Andrew doesn't know Jean - doesn't trust him).

This is also why I’ve said before that I don’t think Andrew/Jean works in Canon romantically or even as friends. Jean cannot be Andrew’s friend & know all these secrets about Andrew. As practically strangers - connected by people they know - Jean doesn’t have to share this information with Andrew.

And Jean can also absolutely never tell Andrew what he knows. Andrew’s reaction would be furious & potentially violent - I’ve said before but I genuinely think a part of Andrew would consider murdering Jean to stop him from knowing & to stop him from being able to tell people - and if they WERE on the cusp of becoming friends, Jean’s sharing this information (which he would have to b/c you cannot be friends with someone while secretly knowing all their darkest secrets and trauma) would completely destroy that friendship from ever developing any further.

I cannot see Andrew ever wanting to see Jean or be around him or potentially even hear about him because it would just be a reminder of the information someone out in the world knows literally everything about what happened to Andrew that Andrew did not want ANYONE to know about. He didn’t want NEIL to know about Proust, and Neil doesn’t even know the details & Andrew tried to silence him immediately. And Andrew by that point was already attached to Neil. Who the fuck is Jean to Andrew in comparison?

Not to mention Andrew already having to suffer through Aaron's trial - like this all would really be far too much.

I think Nora made the right choice having Jean be too uncomfortable to want to interact with Andrew. I also thought it was really good on her part to NOT have Andrew & Jean bond over both being rape survivors, b/c I notice Fanon sometimes does that, and I’ve always found that if written poorly/not handled well it can come across as thinking all rape survivors are of some kind of Hive Mind who are going to have the same thoughts, opinions, reactions, and be besties just b/c they’re rape survivors, ignoring all other aspects of their personalities & how they’ve responded to their trauma.

This is an interesting question! We do have some information from Nora regarding how Andrew would have responded if Neil had died in Baltimore, and we can use that to help build an answer to how Andrew would respond if Neil died further on in the future. In the old EC answers, it’s when Neil goes missing that Andrew truly understands what Neil means to him - that despite everything Andrew has done to keep his barriers in place & not let Neil in, he loves Neil. And it is after he gets Neil back that Andrew realizes he cannot let Neil go, which is why Andrew breaks his deal with Aaron & at the end of TKM stops referring to him and Neil as ‘nothing’ and fully commits to being with Neil (loving Neil).

This is after, as Nora describes, “that bus ride where Neil talked for hours about his life and looked at Andrew like Andrew was the answer to everything.” As we should all (hopefully) know by now, when Andrew says in TKM, “I am not your answer and you sure as fuck aren’t mine,” this line is IRONIC. It’s situational irony that becomes dramatic irony when you re-read the novels because as we know, Kevin’s deal with Andrew involves, “giving Andrew something to build a life around,” and Andrew ends up building a life around NEIL. Neil is his answer - and Andrew IS Neil’s answer, and Andrew enjoys being Neil’s answer. He wants to feel appreciated, like he is a good protector - perhaps even a good man & not a monster, despite the fact that Andrew himself fed into the monster persona, but as Betsy says the monster persona is not actually healthy for Andrew - and he wants to be loved.

Nora then goes on to say, “what little light Andrew had would have gone out that day… it is noticeably and extreme… everyone would have seen the light go out in Andrew.” We know from Nicky and other characters that Andrew before his medication was passively suicidal: joyless, without a future, his high school guidance counselor feared Andrew wouldn’t make it to graduation. That is part of the reason characters like Nicky so strongly believed the court-mandated medication was good for Andrew because he appeared “happy” and “no longer passively suicidal” just because he was smiling and laughing - even though those outward expressions of emotions were not at all indicative of how Andrew truly felt.

However, Andrew HAD been opening himself up to Neil. Emotionally, in sharing secrets with Neil he had had never told anyone before & learning about Neil, as well. Physically, in letting Neil touch him - even his hair - when he hadn’t ever allowed that before, either. Andrew was trying to protect himself by self-censuring, such as during Andrew & Neil’s Exites conversation pre-Hemmick Thanksgiving in TRK because it wasn’t his physical attraction to Neil that Andrew feared, but his emotional attraction. And later on that by insisting that he & Neil were nothing, Andrew could keep himself safe from losing Neil or being betrayed by Neil. But all of that self-protection was for nothing when Neil got kidnapped & it would have destroyed Andrew if Neil had actually been killed in Baltimore.

Andrew wouldn’t have killed himself, however. Andrew doesn’t strike me as the kind of character who is actively suicidal - meaning planning and then attempting a suicide attempt. He has always been more passively suicidal - meaning that he doesn’t see life worth living, and as Nora has described, used to count down the seconds of the day basically waiting to die. He would engage in self-destructive behaviours involving not taking his health seriously: over-drinking, smoking, drunk-driving & speeding. Even when Andrew arranged to be in a deadly car crash to kill Tilda, Andrew wasn’t planning on dying, he just wasn’t valuing his own life or taking the risk to his own life seriously.

And that’s how he would return to being if Neil died (and I would argue at any point in their lives). As Nora said, “Andrew would never let anyone or anything else in… [Neil isn’t something he can recover from]… [Neil] was wanting something for himself when Andrew knew better than to want anything.” She then goes on to say that Neil’s death would, “destroy Andrew’s relationship with everyone in his life, up to including Bee.” And this is Andrew who has only opened himself up to wanting - now imagine if he had spent decades wanting Neil & finally feeling safe with the life he had built.

Side note: this is also why I can’t take Break Up & Make Up Andrew/Neil very seriously. Andrew would not just return to “normal” if he lost Neil even via a break up & continue hooking up with other men. Andrew is a highly codependent person - see his deal for Aaron that he breaks FOR Neil & then precedes to transfer all his codependent tendencies onto Neil as his “reason to live” - and the fact that if Neil had died only a FEW MONTHS into their relationship would have completely destroyed Andrew, it’s impossible to deny just how much Neil means to him. [Also what Nora herself said on Andrew & Neil ever breaking up: “But once Nathaniel is laid to rest that’s pretty much it, there’s no going back. The only things that could break them up are things neither of them would ever consider doing–Neil spilling Andrew’s secrets & belittling them, or Andrew killing one of the original Foxes–so they’re guaranteed to make it work the rest of their lives. They deserve that much, at least, considering what it took them to get to this point. Til death do us part.”] This is how close they are. I’ve noticed since The Odyssey came out some people have been using homophrosyne to describe Andrew/Neil and I completely agree - although I do think Andrew’s crash-out at losing Neil would be far more comparable to when Achilles lost Patroclus, but I digress.

It’s funny, as well b/c when Nora was asked about if Neil had chosen someone else over Andrew (also just to clarify this was a speculative question, not something ever actually considered to be Canon/Canon possible), Nora also said this, “Neil gave Andrew an anchor and a focal point for his life, something worth fighting for and waking up for. If you take that away from him, then there’s nothing else, and Andrew’s learned yet again that it’s not worth the effort to want anything. He’d shut down emotionally, and no one would have the key to open him up again.” Andrew really is out here investing every bit of himself in the first person he felt romantically attracted to at the age of NINETEEN. Personally, love this for Andrew. Most fascinating character of all time, truly comparable to Hua Cheng. And then if Andrew didn’t have Neil, and his deal with Kevin was fulfilled b/c Neil was alive & had made the deal with Ichirou, Neil just wasn’t with Andrew, then, “he’d be done with all of them [The Monsters]. [Andrew] would be adrift, counting down the seconds of existence like he always had… surviving, but not living, not really, and going home alone to a house in Columbia with only drinks for company.” And this is why I cannot abide by any AFTG analysis that tries to suggest Andrew would be okay without Neil when every fact to the contrary suggests that Andrew would be absolutely miserable forever without Neil. [And I'm selfish & love Andrew, so why would any of y'all wanna do this to him??]

Nora then says about Neil dying that the, “only thing that would keep Andrew putting one foot in front of the other would be his promise to Kevin." (so perhaps losing Neil COULD potentially make Andrew actively suicidal if he didn’t have any deals to focus on such as if Kevin no longer needed his protection - remember his deal with Aaron would end at graduation). Nora says that Andrew would feel obligated to get the Foxes to finals - in Neil’s memory - while actively hating Exy more than ever for reminding him of Neil. And she also said Andrew would hate himself, as well: for letting himself get hurt, for losing Neil - and this I think would be equally traumatic for Andrew because I don’t think he would have cared enough about himself to have hated himself before losing Neil. Everything else would for Andrew would be ice: a true nothing - feeling nothing, nothing matters, nothing is important.

And then Nora finishes with this tragedy: without Neil to make a deal with Ichirou, Jean remains with the Ravens & Riko remains alive. And Kevin remains afraid his entire life, requiring Andrew to watch his back - an Andrew who is even more joyless than before, who Kevin will never fulfill his promise to because there is no longer anything for Andrew to build his life around with Neil. Until Andrew finally dies. Andrew’s relationships with his family: Nicky & Aaron would undoubtedly be terrible and he and Aaron would never recover enough to become brothers through therapy with Betsy, and his friendship with Kevin an obligation that Andrew would grow to resent the longer it kept Andrew alive - we also know Andrew’s reaction to Kevin keeping Neil’s secrets when he knew Neil had lived (strangling Kevin). I imagine his reaction would have been ten-times as worse if Neil had died.

Now, even if Neil died in the FAR future and not in Baltimore, I genuinely think Andrew’s devastation at Neil’s death wouldn’t be any different. Because the thing to remember is that Andrew specifically finds life enjoyable because his life is intertwined with Neil’s. I know some readers like the idea that Andrew just has a soft-spot for cats, but Nora once answered that it’s not the cats themselves that Andrew is attached to, he becomes attached to them for being his & Neil’s cats. They are part of Neil, he is taking care of them with Neil. Exy becomes fun because he is playing with Neil - Andrew & Neil are always transferred to the same team by Andrew’s third year going Pro. Sex becomes safe and enjoyable because Andrew is having sex with Neil, who he loves & trusts.

If Andrew has a super crash-out if Neil died after a year of knowing him, I cannot imagine the fallout being any better if Neil died ten, twenty, thirty or even forty years after Andrew has built a life with him. Kevin obviously would no longer require Andrew’s protection, so Andrew also wouldn’t have that obligation to keep him being only passively suicidal instead of actively suicidal. Nicky would be in Germany with Erik, and while his relationship with Aaron would probably be good, Aaron would also be married to Katelyn with or without children depending on which of Nora’s answers you like better.

I think Andrew would continue taking care of their cats - out of an obligation to Neil as they are still a living part of Neil, although I’m sure Andrew at that point would also love the cats in his own way. But after the cats also passed on, I don’t think Andrew would adopt any more. Not without Neil - not when he would have the memories of adopting cats with Neil. If Andrew was still playing Pro Exy at the time of Neil’s death, he would retire immediately. As we know Andrew is trying to quit smoking (for Neil, good for you Jean - you knew exactly where to hit to make Andrew take his health more seriously) but he would undoubtedly take it up again if Neil died: no reason to care about running to protect someone if that person is dead. Perhaps he would even want the same reminder Neil wishes to have of Mary. Andrew would also undoubtedly begin drinking too much, and likely shut himself away from most people. If he didn’t want to build connections with people if Neil were to die before he & Andrew really built a life together, Andrew certainly wouldn’t want to be building connections with others AFTER he and Neil had build a life together. I don’t think Andrew is the type to try to “move on” when his partner dies.

Some may argue that Andrew would be “better healed” in the future to move on from Neil. I won’t get into it now how I disagree with a lot of “healed” Andrew takes that I think far too drastically change his characterization and that "healed" is often used to mean "becomes socially normal" but… a lot of the healing Andrew DOES do in Canon is for other people, particularly Neil. Andrew is not canonically choosing to live for himself. He is choosing to live for Neil & their relationship & the joy he finds in it. Take Neil away from Andrew, and what’s left?