#vapogender

This is textbook Judith Butler Queer Theory. Everything’s all about identities, inventing them (especially from mundane personality traits or medical conditions), constructing them and affirming them, specifically for the purposes of conducting identity politics. And explicitly “queering” (their word) everyone and everything.

If you don’t participate, you’re intolerant. If they’ve designated you as part of the thing, you’re a “traitor” to a thing you never had anything to do with in the first place.

For info on 47XXY Klinefelter Syndrome, and a better understanding of why the message is incoherent. see here: “Biology of DSDs (1) Klinefelter Syndrome”

An open letter to all organisations using LGBTQI+

Inclusion is a wonderful thing – and we should all want a world where inclusion is valued, and everybody can be part of public life and free to live without stigma.  However, inclusion should not involve erasing or misrepresenting the needs of marginalised groups of people, tokenising their existence, without trying to understand their needs – especially when their needs are diverse and complex and not easily boiled down to a single letter.

The I does not stand for Invisible!

So, I would ask all organisations adding the I, do you really understand what this stands for and are you really trying to improve the lives of people living with variations of sex development?  Or are you just adding the I because you think this is the best way to look “inclusive”, whilst ignoring their actual needs?

The I also does not stand for Ignoring needs!

I have written in detail about the term intersex https://differently-normal.com/2021/10/25/the-invention-of-intersex/?preview_id=292&preview_nonce=9f62da2a5a&preview=true and probably the first thing to note, is that the majority of people who are living with differences of sex development, do not identify as intersex, may not know the term is used to describe their medical history and may even find the term difficult or even stigmatising.  It is also increasingly common for people without a DSD, to identify as intersex, with even Polycystic Ovarian Syndrome being claimed as the most common intersex variation, even though most women with PCOS would never describe themselves as intersex and this is not officially recognised by any medical organisation.

So, when adding the I, who are you representing?

1) People without a DSD who choose to identify as intersex – or

2) those with a DSD, who may not use or even like the term?

By adding the I, are you erasing the needs of the most vulnerable, including newly diagnosed children and instead prioritising the needs of people who see “intersex” as an identity, for ever more spurious reasons?

So, let’s think about needs?

Surely any genuinely inclusive organisation would want to consider the needs of the most vulnerable as a priority – and when this comes to the I, surely this would prioritise the 0.2% living with complex differences of sex development.  Some of these conditions are listed below:

Klinefelter’s Syndrome

Turner Syndrome

Mixed Gonadal Dysgenesis (Mosacism)

Complete Gonadal Dysgenesis

Partial Gonadal Dysgenesis

Frasier Syndrome

5-alpha reductase deficiency

17-beta deficiency

Complete Androgen Insensitivity Syndrome

Partial Androgen Insensitivity Syndrome

Persistent Mullerian Duct Syndrome

Ovostesticular DSD

Congenital Adrenal Hyperplasia

Mayer-Rokitansky-Kuster Hauser (MRKH) syndrome

If your organisation does not know the names and does not understand the needs of people living with these complex conditions, are you in any way able to advocate for them?

Did you know that Turner syndrome can be associated with significant heart and kidney problems – or that Klinefelter’s can increase the risk of developing Type 2 diabetes or osteoporosis?

Does your organisation understand that girls with MRKH or Complete Androgen Insensitivity Syndrome, may find out as young teens that they were born without a uterus and with a short vagina and that this can impact on both fertility and sexual function?  Can you provide information about options for vaginal hypoplasia, which can include dilators and surgery?  Can you provide the psychological support needed to come to terms with this information?  Are you aware that she may find her bodily difference being described as “intersex”, incredibly difficult – especially if this is done as part of “inclusivity” training and without understanding anything about her needs?

It may be especially difficult for a young teen, to be faced with their bodily difference being described as neither male or female, as is frequently suggested by lessons using the GenderBread person.  Is this genuinely being “inclusive”, or is this using a vulnerable group of people without considering their needs – and without engaging with expert advice as detailed here. https://dsdfamilies.org/application/files/9116/3519/2768/July_2021_schools.pdf

Does your organisation know that every year in the UK, around 150 babies are born with complex genital difference?  This can be associated with a number of life threatening and life limiting syndromes and further investigations may be needed to determine the cause and in rare cases, whether best to raise baby as a boy or a girl? Do you offer support to new parents facing these issues, so that they are able to advocate for their children?  Are you aware that labelling these babies as neither male or female or a third sex, can increase the risk of unnecessary surgeries?  Do you provide funding so that parents are equipped with the skills to raise confident children living with different bodies?

Does your organisation know that one of the most common causes of atypical genitalia, Congenital Adrenal Hyperplasia (CAH), is a medical emergency and associated with the possibility of a life-threatening adrenal crisis?  Babies can develop arrhythmias, vomiting and dehydration shortly after birth and will need lifelong medication.  What support and information do you offer to these families – and does your organisation understand that the overwhelming majority of people with CAH, reject the term intersex?  Does your organisation understand that someone with CAH may be sitting in your “inclusivity” training and may be distressed by how you are describing their bodily difference?

When adding the I, without really understanding the I, are you misrepresenting the needs and bodies of people born with variations of sex developments and adding to public confusion?  Are you contributing to these conditions being weaponised and turned into memes that are used to discuss issues around sex and gender, without any genuine interest in needs?  Do you consider that there are likely people working in your organisation, who are living with these complex conditions and may find it traumatic to have their medical conditions misrepresented?

Most importantly, when adding the I, are you removing funding opportunities from the most at need – and are you preventing funding being available to meet the needs of those who are living with complex variations of sex development?

If by adding the I, you are genuinely wanting to improve the lives of people born with variations of sex development, we need more than just a hashtag – we need funding and services that prioritise our healthcare and psychological support.  If you genuinely want to be inclusive, do not misrepresent or ignore the voices of the people you are claiming to support – and do not add the I without first listening and understanding our needs.

If you are claiming to stand against interphobia and really want to end discrimination, please start by ensuring you don’t make the I invisible by ignoring our needs.

And finally, if you are serious about inclusion and your organisation really believes that we are more than just a hashtag, consider donating to our needs https://dsdfamilies.org/donate

==

Stop using intersex people as pawns in identity bullshit. Particularly when you don’t know what it means.

Vapogirl requested by @sigils-garbage-fire!

Hewwo This is Koi! XD I’m the boyfriend/fiance of Zax. I’m a asexual, demiromantic queer and i go by fey/feyrs/feyself & they/them/them-self pronouns. My gender is vapogender & I’m a kinnie with koi fish (they’re so cute! (´ω｀). I’m also kin with Frankie from the show Grace & Frankie! I’ve been turned away from truscum ideology because of of them were pretty rude but they can still interact! Just be respectful please >.< I have depression, anxiety, paranoia, PTSD, DID, and ADHD. Here’s my flag for koi fish pride!! .3.

Hewwo this is Zax! 0.0 Koi is my fiance/boyfriend! I’m a polyromantic  requiessexual and I’m kin gender! (My kin types are worm-kin, elf-kin, and bird-kin! (specifically pigeons)). I don’t have any dysphoria and I love my trans body! I have depression, anxiety, OCD, DID, PTSD, and autism! (all self diagnosed) I usually hate truscum and always hate terfs but truscum can interact if they are respectful! I panic very easily so pwease be nice uwu Here’s my flag for my kin gender! 

Here are some possibilities I could find from what you described:

Delusogender: a subset of posigender (a gender identity that is influenced by the positive symptoms of a schizophrenic person) in which one’s gender is influenced by one’s delusions. Strictly for schizophrenic/psychotic/delusional people.

Lysigender: A gender that seems to dissolve and disappear as soon as you attempt to grasp it or figure it out.

Vapogender: A gender that sort of feels like smoke. One can see it and understand it on a shallow level but if one tried to go deeper it disappears, and one is left with no gender and only tiny wisps of the gender one thought it was.

Look, I’m pretty open minded. Trans? Okay. Demigirl/boy? Alright. Non-binary? Sure. Genderfluid? Yes, that one’s cool too. Cis? I don’t see why not. Variations of boy/girl/both/neither make perfect sense to me.

But I found a post today talking about “Papergender” and “Ultragender” (which is basically a superiority complex), and even “Vapogender” was on the Tumblr list of “official” sexualities and genders.

I’m sorry to say that you cannot identify as an inanimate object, and that it is making people with actual gender identities get less respect from other people because your made-up gender is making dumbasses think it’s all made up.

“Cannot” isn’t exactly the word I was looking for because obviously you can identify however the fuck you want. “Shouldn’t” would probably be a better term. I’m just tired of people saying they feel like paper or vapor or attack helicopters because that is literally the joke against “more than 2 genders”.

Femgender is a gender that is feminine, and that doesn’t necessarily has to do with being female.

There is a lot of terminology for genders that are “more or less this gender”, and I’m not sure of what you mean since you referred to this bit as 1) a mix of female and a nonbinary gender which is mostly nonbinary 2) a mostly genderless gender and 3) femgender. I’m going to assume it’s a mostly agender but somewhat female identity, or that it’s a nonbinary identity related to female, but feel free to clarify further if those don’t suit what you are talking about.

Those are some agender spectrum identities which I’ve seen linked to femaleness or to femininity before:

Agender girl: Someone who is agender, but who feels some link to being a girl. They may like presenting as a girl, prefer having a body that is associated with being a girl, feel connected to girlhood somehow, and so on.

Gendervoid or voidgender: “A gender identity defined by absence, a blank space or void where a gender might otherwise be.” Some gendervoid people feel like their gender is mostly a void but with some occasional “gender particles”.

Graygender or greygender: “Describes a person who is ambivalent about their gender identity/expression, but who identifies at least partially with a gender (defined or not) outside of the binary. They may experience a weak sense of gender, or have difficulty defining their gender, or just not be overly involved in gender as a concept.”

Gxrl: “A gender that is both girl and agender/no gender. You can be a girl and agender/no gender at the same time, go between them, or fluctuate between feeling female and not feeling gender.“

Libragender: "A gender identity that is mostly agender, but has a connection to masculinity and/or femininity and/or other gendered feelings. That connection may be static (libragender, librafeminine, libramasculine, etc) or fluid, where one feels that the gender one experiences changes (librafluid).Based on the zodiac sign Libra.”

Miscigender: “A gender that exists but is essentially unfelt and doesn't affect the owner's overall identity. For polygender people, to refer to "miscellaneous" genders that they may have, or for agender people, to describe a gender that is barely there and doesn't change their agender-ness.” 

Genderpp or genderpianissimo: “A gender that is very soft; could be that is is extremely close to or is agender.” 

Spanogender: “A person who barely identifies with a [said] certain or [said] multiple genders and, therefore, is almost entirely agender.(spanogirl, spanoboy, etc) - Uses the prefix, spano-, meaning scanty or scarce. “

Subgender or minumegender: “Mostly agender (¾) with a bit of another gender, ex. subboy, subgirl, etc.“

Vapogender: “A gender that sort of feels like smoke. One can see it and understand it on a shallow level but if one tried to go deeper it disappears, and one is left with no gender and only tiny wisps of the gender one thought it was.”

(You can almost always change gender to girl, such as in vapogirl or graygirl.)

And those are some other nonbinary genders related to female:

Abstragender: “A gender that's related to the abstract concept of another gender. Meant to be used as abstraboy, abstragirl, and so on.“

Altegender: "Derived from shortening the phrase “alternate existence.” It is a xenogender that feels as though it’s in a parallel dimension, on a different plane, in a mirror universe, or just in an alternate existence."

Girlprox, girl-proximal, wprox or woman-proximal: “a term made to include- women (cis and trans, just to affirm that) and - trans folks who are not necessarily women (or are not 100% women as some demigirls may ID, or are not always women as some genderfluid folks may ID, etc etc) but who experience a connection to girlhood, but not girlness.women (group 1) experience girlness because they are girls. they will usually also experience girlhood. girlprox non-women (group 2) experience girlhood, but not girlness, because they are not women.girlhood is a Very Large Concept and one that is difficult to pin down, because it has so many applications. here are some examples (not by any means all of them):- a connection to femininity- a connection to women, despite actual gender identity- a sense of belonging in women’s spaces (specifically in that nebulous community that i believe anyone girlprox creates just by existing near other girlprox folks)- a feminine or femme gender presentation- experience with misogyny- being assigned female at birth and holding that significant to one’s identity- holding female-assigned experiences significant to you and your life (ex: girl scouts, attending an all-girl school)- and, of course, identifying partially or sometimes or always as a woman - this is not required for girlhood, but often accompanies it.”

Juxera: “A gender relative to female, but is something separate and entirely on it’s own. It is not outside the gender spectrum."

Mollgender or molligender: “1) A gender identity that is largely related to a certain gender, but feels soft, as if it has blurred into other genders. Used as mollgirl, mollboy, mollinonbinary, etc.2) A gender that is quiet, soft and subdued. Can be used to mean a gender that feels gentle, not too present or blurred somehow.“

Nonbinary girl: “A nonbinary gender with feminine or 'girl' qualities.“

Offgender: “A gender that closely represents/is most closely represented by another gender, but is not that gender. Can be likened to what the color off-white is to white for descriptive purposes. Similar in definition to paragender and perigender.”

Paragender: "A gender identity that is close to, but not exactly, a gender. For instance, someone who is a paraboy may feel that their gender is near to, but not quite male/masculine."

Vectorgender: “When your gender is in the direction of something, but not actually that something, ie. a vectorgirl would be someone with a gender pointed in or traveling in the direction of girlness, but who is not actually a girl.“

Volitogender: “When one's gender feels hovering or floating. Can be combined with other genders. (volitoboy, girl, fluid, flux, etc)“

Xirl: “ Someone who identifies in some way as a nonbinary girl or nonbinary girl-adjacent. Someone who identifies with some part of woman/girlhood but who wants a more nonbinary and neutral sounding word because they aren’t entirely girls or don't want to be associated with the typical ideas brought up by the word “girl”.”

And then there are a lot of other possibilities, such as feminine genders that aren’t female, or xenogenders that may be woman-related somehow... but this post is already long enough. I hope it helps.

Hey anon,

Yes, I can do my best to help you. I would also advise you take a look at @genderlist and @ask-pride-color-schemes, as they both have pretty comprehensive lists of gender identities, and are pretty good about getting back to people when they ask what genders might fit (xyz) criteria.

I would also advise you to go through the wikia yourself. (here’s a link) http://gender.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Gender_Identities

For the purpose of this list, I will be assuming that by she/her and they/them genders, you mean feminine and neutral/other genders. (Just a reminder that pronouns don’t necessarily equal gender, but I recognize that in your comfort with these pronouns, you may (in this case) be indicating a feminine or neutral gender).

So here’s what I know of and have found in a relatively quick google search:

Feminine: 

Juxera: a gender which is feminine and similar to girl, but on a separate plane to itself. (one of the genders I shift to is juxera, and a way that I explain it that seems to make sense is that if woman/girl is red, juxera might be coral or maroon.)

Demigirl: (see demigender below)

Feminine and/or nonbinary:

Demigender: (From the wikia) “Demigender is a gender identity that involves feeling a partial, but not a full, connection to a particular gender identity or just to the concept of gender. Demigender people often identify as non-binary. Demigender is not necessarily a partial connection to gender (like male or female) and a partial connection to agender, instead it is more commonly referred to as a partial connection to a third gender that possibly can’t be described by the term agender or is just not the absence of a gender. Demigender people may feel that partial connection is a gender, but it cannot necessarily be described.”

Vocigender: gender which is weak or hollow. Similar to greygender, but ‘-gender’ can be changed to express the connection (vocigirl, vociboy, etc)

Nanogender: (from the wikia) gender identities that are a little of one gender and mostly another or others. These can be any genders. The “other” portion does not have to be only one gender. Under this definition, people who are nanogender have a nonbinary gender and are transgender. Also unlike demigenders, the ”other” can be any gender or a mix of some.

Vapogender: (from the wikia) is a gender that sort of feels like smoke; can be seen on a shallow level but once you go deeper, it disappears and you are left with no gender and only tiny wisps of what you thought it was.

Nonbinary:

Aporagender: (umbrella term, from the wikia) a gender separate from male, female, and anything in between while still having a strong gendered feeling.

Maverique: (from the wikia) a nonbinary gender identity characterized by autonomy and inner conviction regarding a sense of self that is entirely independent of male/masculinity, female/femininity or anything which derives from the two while still being neither without gender nor of a neutral gender.

Antigender: (from the wikia) Genders that can only be defined as the opposite of an existing gender.

Hope this helps,

Okay, so I can think of several different labels that might fit with the different experiences you described here. The part about being fluid between partial genders sounds like demifluid, not really caring about your gender sounds like cassgender, and your gender fading away/changing every time you settle on a label sounds like genderflight, lysigender, or vapogender.

Demifluid: When your gender is fluid between demigenders.

Cassgender: A gender identity where one feels that their gender is unimportant or is indifferent to the idea of gender.

Genderflight: A fluid gender that feels fleeting, that vanishes before one can define exactly what it is.

Lysigender: A gender that seems to dissolve and disappear as soon as you attempt to grasp it or figure it out.