#pinciotti

Donna treated Eric like shit and Eric deserved better IN SOME CASES. Both characters had their flaws but this is just what stood out most to me. 

OK hear me out though please. Donna was a great character and really did well with her ideas about feminism and portrayed the character very well for growing up in a not normal family, but as the seasons went on she started getting worse qualities. Eric wasn't perfect either though, that’s another conversation. One main example is the whole sex thing. 100% a girl should only have sex with a guy if she feels comfortable, but in no way should she be teasing about saying yes and then changing her mind. So many times she told Eric that they would and then would change her mind, yes in a joke but still, and then would get mad at Eric if he pushed it or whatever. CASE IN POINT she is complaining to Hyde about something and Hyde puts her in her place pretty much saying ‘Eric treats you so well, he does everything for you and you’re not even sleeping with him’. great example at how she took Eric for granted, although he isn’t a perfect character either. 

Another prime example is the Pricemart ball episode. She goes on and on about ‘it’s not a date’, as soon as he starts having fun with a nice girl, she flips out saying it’s a date. bearing in mind that she then goes to Casey and blah blah. She also flips out when she finds out that Eric went out ONCE with slushy girl and didn't even do anything, yet she can do a fuck ton with Casey, like almost sleep with him and everything is ok??? Honestly the whole relationship was toxic, from both sides. 

• if you’re saving/using please like this post ♡

This is not an ask, but rather a comment discussing the factuality of plans you posted regarding the Forman house, and its association with the Pinciotti house, on January 12, 2016.

The Forman home in particular has always been interesting to me, and has served as much as an annoyance as it has an intrigue. I too have attempted to draft its floor plan, and find it does not work terribly well, which is frustrating.

The major anomaly is the Forman’s basement, in its alignment with the rest of the house, it should be located underneath the dining room, with the stairs in the main part, running directly parallel to the staircase above; architecturally, it just makes sense. But, in the episode ‘Won’t Get Fooled Again’ (Season 6, Episode 13), Red finds that Hyde has bored a hole through the floor down into the basement, so as to commandeer Red’s newly bought cable television, down to the basement. When Red confronts Hyde about it, in the basement, he looks up as though he were looking toward the hole, which of course can’t be if the house were perfect, because if that were true you would have to go down to the basement from the front door.

So, in this situation, we must consider that Hyde has bored a hole in the living room floor, has trailed a wire from under the living room floor under the entire width of the house, down from the ceiling in the basement, and that is what Red is seeing when he confronts Hyde about his hijacked cable; the wire being all the while pinned to the underneath of the floor. In the sets from the show, the basement set seems to display something similar to the outside door, at the top level, but this may be for use in other shots.

The door to the basement is obvious to see, it is just off the kitchen to the right, in the passage between the kitchen and the dining room. Interestingly, there is also a door opposite this, which technically would lead into the enclosed yard behind the house, between the garage, and the dining room side of the house. If the exit to the basement is followed (where the friends usually come in), it must exit somewhere immediately to the right of where this door by the dining room exits outside. This would mean that there are hedged shrubs immediately to the right of this door; as in early seasons, when the stairs up to the surface were shown, there was always shown to be the edges of shrubs, or hedges, on either side of the opening (which is obviously meant to be a double door hatch.)

The windows in the basement are confusing as the one by the basement stairs (from inside the house), could not be a window, so it might be a laundry chute, or some sort of dumb-waiter perhaps. Interestingly, I have seen the Victorian house in the background setting of the Pinciotti’s backyard in another television show, namely, outside the internal scenes of Jessica Fletcher’s home at the fictional village of Cabot Cove, Maine, in 'Murder She Wrote.’

The Forman house is interesting too, from a narrative related perspective, as it displays a home which has technically been modified at some point in its history, as the 'real’ kitchen wall in the 'original’ house, would technically have been the wall removed immediately behind Kitty’s kitchen sink. The extended wall often seen behind Red’s head at breakfast, is hard to pin down, but it seems that it diverges at a 45 degree angle behind Red, where the cabinet is, then sures up for little more than a foot, where it takes a right angle back down the entire length of the house (as the fourth wall was shown in the kitchen, in one episode distinctly.) The top of the extension roof is seen in one or more episodes, displaying distinctly that it is not built upon, but the fabric of the original house is.

And, Red and Kitty’s bedroom is often heard to be above the living room, as in episodes when they have been overheard upstairs, references are often made to the part of the house above the living room lounge.

I also believe that the Forman’s have two bathrooms. There is one bathroom between, or near both bedrooms of Eric and Laurie (which are acorss from one another), this is the main bathroom, and another 'en-suite’, off Red and Kitty’s bedroom; if I remember correctly.

Eric’s room has to be above the original kitchen, as Donna climbs up the trellis by the kitchen extension to get into Eric’s bedroom.

There is also the Pinciotti/Forman survey error, where Bob and Midge attack Red and Kitty over a survey error which they claim means Bob owns half of Red’s garage (side to middle). It is only late in this episode that Red shows Bob, in the Pinciotti’s kitchen, that he has the survey plan upside down. Red is then told to get out of their house, which he does with a big smile. He stops standing at the back door of the Pinciotti’s kitchen, where he proclaims that he is out. Unfortunately, the name and number of this exact episode eludes me at the moment. But, this might help you ascertain the supposed relationship between the two houses.

And to clarify, whenever a car leaves the drive-way, from the Forman garage, it goes directly onto the street, as noticed by the people watching the car leave. So no, the driveway does not curve around the house. Also the front porch of the house, if I remember well enough, has its stairs to the side of the house (as in, the stairs to the porch descend by the living room side of the house; they do not just jut straight out from the front door.) I have often wondered whether the house was on a street corner, but the house across from that vantage seems too close to allow for a street; but then it could be just a small street.

Finally, the Pinciotti house technically has to have a minimum of three or four bedrooms, because Donna had a younger sister Tina who also lived there, as well as her older sister, Valerie. And, by the way it is spoken about by Bob, the Pinciotti house sounds more 'split-level’ than 'upstairs and downstairs.’

I hope this helps with certain aspects of the Foreman house, as well as those of the Pinciotti residence.

Regards, Braston.

Thank you for submitting this! I actually have no idea how long this has been sitting in my ask box, so I apologize if you sent this a while ago. As soon as I noticed it just now I decided to post it.

Briefly, I just want to say that I do not think that it can be said there is “factuality” to my house plans. There is plenty of evidence that supports and negates my house plans for the show, however, as the homes do not actually exist, there are no facts; no right or wrong answers. I discussed here how the TV set homes are ‘mosaic models’ as they are constantly changing to accommodate the needs of the show, so there can be no facts when the ‘facts’ are always changing.

A lot of the factors you mention are ones that I considered when I drew my versions of their houses. But really, I know there is absolutely no way to meet all the requirements to make every scene from every episode of the show make sense, so I took the scenes/episodes that I found to be most significant in playing a role in these homes when I made my drawings. That combined with the fact that my dad’s actual job is to design and build homes, I grew up surrounded by a lot of blueprints and used what knowledge I had from that when I made my designs.

That being said, I find it fascinating how everyone who has commented on my post (if anyone hasn’t seen it and is curious, you can find them here and here) has seen the houses differently. But I do not think that anyone’s version, including my own, is necessarily more accurate than the others. After all, it is a television set that is designed for the convenience of the camera, not being accurate in the details of the house. So by taking a factor from one scene in one episode into consideration (for instance, you mentioned the TV cable Hyde ran through the basement ceiling), can throw off the details supported by a different scene from a different episode.

So there are things we have to overlook. Like I chose to overlook the fact that people back straight out of the driveway, because to me it makes more sense for a driveway to start in the front of the house. Maybe the curve around the house is wide which is why they can back up straight for a while? Or, after all, Eric and his friends are teenagers, so I wouldn’t put it past them to just ride over the curb instead of going all the way down the drive. Or maybe there is no curve, like the way you see it. We don’t actually know, but I think that’s the beauty of it – it becomes up to us, the fans, what we individually want to think.