Mar 15
Neoaves superorder clade showdown - section 5
Which is the best bird?
Pennant-winged nightjar
Common raven
Voting ended onMar 22
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Neoaves superorder clade showdown - section 5
Which is the best bird?
Pennant-winged nightjar
Common raven
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Neoaves superorder clade showdown - semifinal round 2
Which is the best bird?
Common loon
Atlantic puffin
Neoaves superorder clade showdown - section 4
Which is the best bird?
Common loon
Lesser florican
Neoaves superorder clade showdown - section 3
Which is the best bird?
Sunbittern
Atlantic puffin
Neoaves superorder clade showdown - section 1
Which is the best bird?
South Island takahe
Hoatzin
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https://vxtwitter.com/albertonykus/status/1757175498378219573?s=20
Curious as to your thoughts on the legitimacy of this study? Cause it doesn't seem to line up with what we know of previous studies and the fossil record
I study how birds adapted to the PETM and I am extremely skeptical about their claim that this water bird clade they recovered emerged right after - one of the best bird fossil records from the Paleocene we have is stem-penguins. So clearly, they were around before then. And they don't even acknowledge that in the paper!
The phylogeny is interesting but as always I am a major skeptic about molecular clocks and this is no exception, given, again, the fossils that directly contradict the damn conclusion.
Other than that I haven't had time to go in depth enough, but those are my initial thoughts
Side note, when will a stable Neoavian phylogeny return from the war
The paper, for those curious:
Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences (PNAS), a peer reviewed journal of the National Academy of Sciences (NAS) - an authoritative
when you say we don't know how modern birds are interrelated.... how is that something we don't know about?? we know all these other things about whats related to what but not how birds are related? good lord what is going on in there????
tldr Neoaves didn't have many members at the end cretaceous extinction, it's possible only one made it through. the giant amount of empty niches allowed for Neoavians to diversify rapidly, making their interrelationships a giant mess because it's harder to detect what diverged first via their genes, and the fossil record from that time is nooooot great
So we don't know, exactly, how most birds are related to each other
so, for fun:
vote for a recent neoavian phylogeny hypothesis
Jarvis 2014 (Columbea + Passerea)
Prum 2015 (Strisores (Columbaves (Gruiformes (Aequorlitornithes + Inopinaves))))
Suh 2016 (hard polytomy)
Reddy 2017 (Columba + Different Passerea than Jarvis)
Kuhl 2021 (too complicated for me to fit in the poll)
Braun 2021 (mirandornithes + columbimorphae + polytomy of everything else)
None of these
help I don't know what's going on
I think neoaves is gonna completely fall apart as a clade
Something else entirely I didn't account for
more polls that can't get derailed
had to cut the et al for space, sorry
enjoy