#kisou

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“There's something different about people who express themselves with their bodies and people who express themselves with instruments”

ーーYou first bought a guitar because you wanted to be in a band, right?

Kyo：I had the image that band = guitar (laugh). If I wanted to play in a band, I'd want to own an instrument, but I am not able to do that at all.

ーーHave you ever challenged any songs?

Kyo：Back then, X (now X JAPAN) was really popular, and there were quite a few people playing X around me so I was given the score of “BLUE BLOOD."* But I'm such a beginner that I don't even know which ones are difficult and which ones are easy. I looked at the score and wondered if I could do something like this. The guitar soon became not something to play, but something to display (laugh).

*Blue Blood is the second album by X Japan, released in 1989

ーーEven so, you still couldn't get over your passion for the band, so your next choice was to be the vocalist?

Kyo：I borrowed a bass from my friends, but it was just for fun. HIDE-san (X JAPAN) was the first guitarist I liked, but I'm generally attracted to vocalists. Moreover, there were many special vocalists. It just so happened that a lot of people in the band that I like wear makeup, so I thought I'd like to be part of a band like that. At the same time, I also liked Endo Michiro-san* (THE STALIN) and other punk music, but they didn't blend well back then, in my opinion. Isn't it a different genre? There were not many bands that could coexist in multiple music genres, probably GASTUNK. I had the impression that if I was going to do different types of music, I would have to do it separately. That's why I joined various bands. There were Punk-style bands, and there were also Visual-kei bands.

*遠藤ミチロウ (Endo Michiro) is the vocalist of THE STALIN.

ーーWere you not that particular about music style or genre?

Kyo：No, I really like intense music.

ーーWas it the era when Endo Michiro-san was throwing pig heads at live shows from THE STALIN?

Kyo：When I was in the second grade of middle school, it was the time when X had released “BLUE BLOOD”, and BUCK-TICK had almost released “TABOO"* or not. I only fell in love with THE STALIN later.

*TABOO is the fourth album by BUCK-TICK, released in 1989

ーーThe late 1980s was a time when the indie scene in Kansai was very strong.

Kyo：But I was still in middle school (laugh). The only source of information was TV, and I was like, “What's indie?” That's why I know X and BUCK-TICK. Somehow, I later learned about THE STALIN and GASTUNK. Back then, there was a video called “Takarajima VOS"*. There were a lot of other omnibus videos out there, so I was shopping all over the place and looking for them.

*宝島vos (Takarajima VOS)

ーーYou’ve got a lot of things that attract you. Was it all intense (music) since then?

Kyo：Yeah. Thrash Metal was also in fashion, and Metallica was becoming popular. And Skid Row, which is not Thrash Metal, was also popular back then. But I wasn’t attracted to that. I don't like bands that look good in bandana (laugh). After graduating from middle school, I worked at the central market in Kyoto. I had blonde hair and was approached by a band member who was working at the central market. Later, I became a roadie for their band, which was a Hard rock band.

ーーWas it a Bandana-kei band which you didn't like very much?

Kyo：It's a Bandana-kei band, but they wore makeup. I toured with that band as a roadie. After watching many bands, I gradually understood what was going on, because I also had formed several local bands.

ーーDid you get any advice from the bands you were with or from the bands you met on tour?

Kyo：I was 15 years old back then, and the people in the band I was with were 22 or 23, so I was still like a child. We didn't have too many deep conversations, like what a vocalist is or how a song is made. My specialty was loading and unloading equipment and making hair stand up. But I noticed something. The band members were close, but there was a little distance between the vocalist and the instrumentalists. There's something different between people who express themselves with their bodies and people who express themselves with instruments. And like not drinking, health care, these are different from people who play instruments, right? I learned a lot.

ーーAs a vocalist, was there anything about the live experience that blew your mind?

Kyo：It's a bit special… Back then, Kamaitachi* was popular in my hometown Kyoto, and they were all red. I don't know if it was an agreement with the company or not, but the band I was with as a roadie all wore gold enamel outfits.* Also, when they released an album, they didn't play any songs from the album. They said, “The company chose those songs on their own, and we don't really want to play them at our shows.” I've been looking at things like that, so I thought the company was not very good (laugh). If possible, I would do my best to do it myself.

*かまいたち (Kamaitachi) is a Visual-kei band that formed in Kyoto in 1985 and disbanded in 1991. All the members had red hair.

*金のエナメル。I guess it's some kind of material (?)

ーーYou thought it's not good for adults to get involved?

Kyo：I thought it would be bad (laugh). It gave me a strange image. So I tried to find members, put up flyers in music stores and second-hand CD stores, contacted them myself to form a band, but nothing really went well. It's really difficult to start a band.

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“I don't want to make any compromises I don't want to do anything else”

ーーDid you have an ideal form for the band?

Kyo：There was absolutely something that I thought was cool. I can't put it into concrete words, but there was something unshakable. In my first band back then, there were about 8 people in the audience, and we were playing against about 5 other bands, so there were only about 30 people in total. Tables and chairs were set up, and after their favorite band was finished, the audience would start eating. I understood that, but I got very angry when people talked while I was performing, so I complained about it during the MC. I think I feel the same way from then to now (laugh). I knew that the fans and the audience were important, but I wasn't mainly focused on them, and I would do exactly what I wanted to do.

ーーIsn’t it similar? Wearing white makeup on face* and waving a bamboo sword (laugh). It's like a live fight.

*白塗り。It's like the Kabuki actor or the Geisha who puts on white makeup from face to neck.

Kyo：That's the punk band (laugh). We didn't fight, but we played shows similar to that. I was not interested in being a vocalist who sings well. Even if I didn't sing, I thought it was fine as long as I could express what I wanted to express and the atmosphere of the moment. There was no fixed concept that I had to sing just because I am a vocalist. That's why I didn't sing much at live shows back then. Even after I became DIR EN GREY, until the end of the “Withering to Death.” tour, I was still called a vocalist who doesn't sing. I did what I wanted to do, but I didn't feel that I had to sing because I'm a vocalist. It was like that.

ーーDid you feel like you were letting out your inner anxiety and confusion?

Kyo：That's part of it, but it might have been better if I was a part of my role as a performer. It would be good if I could show what I think is cool and what I want to do.

ーーDo you want to see the surprised faces of the audience?

Kyo：I think it happened to some extent, but after the live show, I just want to perform on stage that I am satisfied with. This is a very self-centered idea. I was satisfied, so everyone else must be satisfied as well and that's why they came to the show, right? For example, no one would want Endo Michiro-san to sing for the audience. It's like Endo Michiro-san is doing whatever he wants. That's what I wanted to be like. That's why I'm not saying anything like trying to be happy through our songs and MCs. That's how much I hated it.

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“I was not interested in being a vocalist who sings well There's no concept that I have to sing just because I'm a vocalist”

“I don't want to leave any regrets On the contrary, I want to move forward to a more difficult place”

ーーLiving with trauma all the time is also the main reason, right?

Kyo：That's probably true. The only person I can trust is myself, and basically I always think I can't get along with other people, or maybe I just refuse to get along with them. When I was in my previous band, and maybe in the early days of DIR EN GREY, I didn't talk to other bands at all, so I was told by people around me that I had anthropophobia. Of course, they weren't my enemies, but even if I told them, they wouldn't understand. It was like I had given up. In that case, I don't want to make any compromises in what I do, and I don't want to do anything else.

ーーYou have shown a colorful voice from the early days to now. Did you always want to broaden the range of expression in the songs?

Kyo：No, until the end of “MACABRE”, I wanted to do more than just sing. It’s kind of hard to explain, but I didn't think too much about singing or voice. To be honest, I was more prickly in DIR EN GREY's indies period and my previous bands. I had no money, no friends, and always felt like I was going to explode. That feeling faded away unconsciously after our major debut, I guess it's because I was busy doing interviews and photographing every day. After several days of interviews from morning to night, instead of anger and dissatisfaction, I thought more about the fellowship with the members and the need to overcome this busy period. Something I cared about had changed. I think my sweetest period was about halfway through the MACABRE Tour until I injured my ear (sudden hearing loss in the left ear). That's why it was my least favorite period. I was not sure how much longer I would be able to do it after my ear injury. I had to make sure I didn't go back to my naive self so that I wouldn't have any regrets. For that reason, I decided to go to more difficult places and became more strict with myself. During the period of “Kisou”, we studied and incorporated new musical tastes into what we've been creating up until now. From there, I started to put more emphasis on my own vocal style. I started thinking about how to use my voice and what only I could do. When creating these works, I paid close attention to details such as the localization of the voice and the texture. But I thought that works are works and live performances are live performances, which are different things, so people kept saying that I was a vocalist who couldn't sing. I was also told that “DIR EN GREY should just release CDs” or “If you can't sing it live, don't do it”, but in my mind, CDs are CDs and live performances are live performances. If you want exactly the same things as CDs, please listen to CDs. At live shows, you can still feel something even without singing, right?

ーーThose live shows were filled with great tension. You mentioned the word "study." What exactly did you do?

Kyo：I'd say I've started listening to all kinds of music, regardless of genre. Didn't I just say that I don't like hard rock music? But that's just what I imagined, so I started listening to it trying to find something. In my own way, though. Still, it's okay to hate what you hate. I think that was when I listened to the most variety of music. There was no YouTube yet, and videos were not easily available, but back then Marilyn Manson simply made an impact on me, and so did Nine Inch Nails. I realized that there were foreigners who were visually interesting. There might have been more foreigners if I went back further, but I had never heard of them. Then I started listening to various kinds of music, but the vocalists I liked were overwhelmingly Japanese.

ーーEndo Michiro-san and Nakamori Akina-san. Also Cocco-san who you had been listening to a lot since those days.

Kyo：I liked BAKI-san from GASTUNK and KIBA-san from Gargoyle as well. I liked KIBA-san's unique style of not moving or laughing at all during live performances back then. I also liked the early VIRUS and the bassist NOBORU-san. I liked those eccentric people.

ーーDid you become prickly because of your admiration for eccentricity?

Kyo：Or rather, there were some strange rules in my mind that I didn't realize until I injured my ear. It didn't matter after the injury, the strange rules started to be broken, but I was worried that it would be bad for the image of the band. I think I was able to break down the various elements I had before and put them together without rules.

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“The style that only I can create I packed it all into UROBOROS”

ーーThen it spurred on and led to insane live performances. I guess you just couldn't stop yourself anymore. There have been many times where you started bleeding after shows and an ambulance was waiting at the backstage entrance. So what kind of mental state were you in when you were standing on stage?

Kyo：I think the most extreme tour was the “Withering to death.” Back then, the members did not get along well with each other, and the stage was a place for me to release myself. I didn't sing many songs, and if I didn't like something, I would go back to the dressing room right away, so I guess I was too honest with myself (bitter smile). I've become even more prickly than the indies period, and I greedily did everything that I wanted to do or that I thought was my expression. I was getting more and more extreme, and even vomiting blood, but I also had the feeling that it was just a fake, and I thought that was boring. I decided to try to do it with the real thing. I wanted to make the expression of pain in the lyrics more realistic, so that people could understand just by looking at it. I wanted to express it freely using my own body, sweat, blood, and various other things. So it exploded.

ーーI think it was “THE MARROW OF A BONE” that changed things in terms of vocal approach and style. It's also swerving in extreme directions such as death, growl, guttural, etc.

Kyo：Up until “Withering to death.”, I was creating works as works, and the live performance was like an explosion of myself. “THE MARROW OF A BONE” is a combination of both sides. The single “RYOUJOKU NO AME” (凌辱の雨) had harmonies and a beautiful finish, but the album is a single piece with no harmonies. We changed the way we made the song because we wanted to make it as close to the live performance as possible and express aggressiveness. I kept the vocals as close to the live show as possible, with as few takes as possible, and kept the momentum going. So when I listen to it now, I think it's the most painful song I've ever sung.

ーーAt the same time, the many ways of using your voice have become a part of your personality as a vocalist. What kind of process did you go through to broaden your singing style?

Kyo：In my opinion, I think it has been narrowed. Up until “Withering to death.” I had been using various techniques to expand my voice in the work, but with “THE MARROW OF A BONE” it suddenly shrunk. After performing live, I got really pissed off at being called “The vocalist who cannot sing” (laugh). Some people thought that I was just doing a good job of making sound recordings on the computer (laugh). Until then, I had intentionally included soundtracks that without singing in the coupling song of singles. But in the end, nothing seemed to be conveyed. There was a great sense of distance, so I felt that I was the only one walking to an unknown place, I had to pull them up. So I decided to raise the quality of our works above “Withering to death.” From a global perspective, what is the style that only I could create? I did some research on myself, and I packed it all into “UROBOROS.” Moreover, I felt like I've almost 100% recreated it in live performances so no one would complain. After I actually did it, I was able to create exactly what I had envisioned, and I felt satisfied that I could become a singer with a unique style. After that, when we toured overseas, I was selected in many rankings in the metal vocalist category, and I felt that I had done nothing wrong. I think it was with “UROBOROS” that I finally found a match between my live performances and our works.

ーーFrom that album, you started recording songs at home.

Kyo：I created an environment at home where I can sing when I want to sing. Until then, I had been singing in an environment where I had to go to a studio and have an engineer there. But I thought that was not good enough. I felt that this style would not be complete unless I was in a position to sing with the feelings I wanted and at the time I wanted.

ーーAs a result, you have quite a vocal range from growl to clean. Do you sometimes approach singing stoically, thinking that in order to perfect your style, you need to broaden your vocal range?

Kyo：There are vocalists who can somehow shout, sing, and have a high-pitched voice. However, I realized that there aren't many vocalists who can take each of these to a very high level, so I researched and pursued them greedily. Think about it, “UROBOROS” is still a bit naive, but it feels like the first part of the current style.

ーーWhat exactly do you mean by research? If you're a guitarist, it's easy to copy a song you've never played before and make it your own.

Kyo：I don't have that kind of know-how, and I haven't had voice training. When we make new songs, I sing based on my first impression of the song that the members brought. Then I add my own color to it in my own way while paying attention to those impressions, that's how the style was formed. I just accepted what came out naturally from me and repeated it over and over again. Also, I did it in a way that I can enjoy. “ここでこう来んのかい!?”* It's like I'm enjoying it myself (laugh). In the end, music always tickles my heart. It feels good when the chorus comes just when you think it's coming. I made it in such a way that I could enjoy it myself, and then it came up with something bizarre (laugh). If you are just trying to be like someone else, you are just repeating the same thing from the beginning, and you will never be able to create something new. The reason you find something interesting is because you've never seen it before. I don't think I can create anything new without doing so, so I'm just doing what I think.

*Sorry I don't know how to translate it into English

ーーIt depends on the song, but does it take a long time for you to find the vocal arrangement?

Kyo：It doesn't take much time. There are no rules anymore, so when I hear a song, I just kind of sing it, and sometimes it is almost completely decided on that basis. Of course, there are times when I have to remake it. I used to listen to all kinds of music for a while, but now I don't listen to much music anymore. If you listen to only one kind of music all the time, you may become fixated on it. I don't like that either.  When I listen to a piece of new song and want it to be intense, I don't imagine an intense band, but rather an intense, messy picture. Or it's sad to see a withering leaf. That's probably where I get my strongest images from.

ーーYou express yourself through music, but music is definitely not the only thing that sparks your imagination.

Kyo：That's right. I just pull from what I feel and see in daily life and make it into musical form. I feel like anything is possible when it comes to expression.

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“I don't practice at all I think of live performances as practice”

ーーAt your live performances, there is a vocal solo piece called “INWARD SCREAM”, or a place to express yourself. How did you start that?

Kyo：Basically, I don't talk during live performances. In the past, I used to force myself to talk, but there was a strange idea in the company that I had to do MC because I'm a vocalist. Why do I have to do all the talking? But DIR EN GREY has a lot of songs in different tunings, so there there are often gaps between songs. And when I don't do MC, the scene becomes quiet, doesn't it? (laugh) So I asked them to let me do it without MC because I had my own idea. The people in the company were reluctant, but once I did it, their attitude changed (laugh).  Fans sometimes ask us to play DIR EN GREY songs, if I’m going to sing “INWARD SCREAM”. But even if we didn't have “INWARD SCREAM”, we wouldn't have more songs (laugh). I hope you understand that first (laugh). We are not doing this by reducing the number of songs.

ーーI feel like I'm suddenly lured into the world of esotericism with “INWARD SCREAM”. Compared to songs that have already been released as sound sources, do you feel that you are in a different world in terms of tension?

Kyo：Not really, but the binding will be completely removed. If it's a DIR EN GREY song, the melody is already decided, and to a certain extent, the lyrics and the worldview of the song are also decided. These just came naturally from within me. But “INWARD SCREAM” is more like a state of zero, or rather, a flow from the previous song, and what kind of movement and voice I will make. It is a free expression of those things. I've always been interested in “living things”*. It is important to keep the same quality as CDs, and unlike in the past, I've raised the minimum standard. Even so, I still want to cherish the freedom that can only be felt at that moment, and I don't want to be tied down to the songs.

*生物

ーーI guess you are seen as quite eccentric overseas.

Kyo：Is that so? I am always looking for a vocalist that only I can be. I have always been non-style, but I like the process of creating and then destroying, so I want to keep changing.

ーーIs this the same for your ideal style?

Kyo：There is no such thing for me. It's just like, “I want to do this”, “I want to express myself like this at the next show.” These thoughts keep changing during the tour, that's how I feel. Lately, I feel like I'm moving further and further to the edge (bitter smile).

ーーYou have a shaved head and piercings, and sometimes you put on make-up and turn into four eyes, so it looks like you've gone completely out of bounds (laugh).

Kyo：Yeah, yeah (laugh). It doesn't matter (laugh).

ーーIt's also related to the expression “INWARD SCREAM”, you insist on using a shielded microphone on stage, right?

Kyo：To be honest, it doesn't matter either way. Without a shield, I can broaden my performance range, and with a shield, I can express myself in different ways. However, I prefer to have a shield. On stage, everyone is dressed all in black. A bright red shield is like a blood vessel, and it gives me an impression of being alive, and the sound is connected to the shield. Also, wireless microphones are thick in structure, right? That's just not cool. If there is a shield attached, there are restrictions on my movement, but I have a weird rebellious feeling that I should express myself regardless of the restrictions (laugh). Besides, the sound is usually better with a shield. It also avoids any trouble with radio waves. As long as it is shielded, I don't care what kind of microphone it is, whether it's dry sounding* or the front end has gotten bumpy (laugh).

*カスカスのマイク

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“Make the expression of pain more realistic I wanted to express freely using my own body, sweat and blood”

ーーAren't you particular about the recording microphone?

Kyo：I don't care what kind of microphone I use, but I sing the same way on the recording as I do on stage. I am not used to singing with my hands behind my back on a stand mic (laugh). I always sing with a hand mic. That way I can control the mic subtly, such as moving it closer or further away with my hand, and I can use it live as it is. I enjoy doing things like creating delay-like effects using only my own live voice, without using a delay device. I also enjoy doing things like making my voice sound quieter by using a live voice and a hand microphone instead of using a machine to reduce the volume or level. “AGITATED SCREAMS OF MAGGOTS -UNPLUGGED-” was recorded in one shot, but there's a clattering sound at the end. I did that by rubbing the hand mic against myself and banging it against the wall (laugh). I prefer the hand mic because I can act on my own ideas right away.

ーーDo you have any recent vocal practice tips?

Kyo：My vocal range has expanded, and people say that I must have practiced a lot. But I don't practice at all. I think of live performances as practice (laugh). When I record a song, the director will tell me how far the key has been extended. It was interesting to me, and I would think to myself, “Next time, I got this far, and then this far more.” There was a time when I played it like a strategy game, but I got tired of it now.

ーーDoes it have anything to do with the menacing thought, “If other guys can do it, I can do it too?”

Kyo：No, no, I have a very low opinion of myself. Other vocalists practice hard and put in a lot of effort. I always think, “No, no, I can't do it.” It's really impossible for me.

(END)

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#excerpt: deg players book