#daasaku

— Were you actually on bad terms?

Oda: It was more that Ishida-san didn’t enjoy being around me. I didn’t realize at all. (laughs)

Ishida: Oda hugged me from behind on the very day she joined! The way she tried to get close to me so quickly was just…. no. (laughs) Also, I wasn’t a fan of her overconfidence. It’s great to be self-assured and I understand now that it was a defense mechanism for a young girl joining all by herself, but back then, Oda was… not prickly, but a bit off-kilter, you know?  (laughs)

Oda: I was terribly difficult with nothing but blind confidence! Aside from Michishige-san, my seniors weren’t significantly more experienced or join that much earlier than me. I wanted to race ahead and beat them. I was incredibly proud whenever I got a singing line or was picked for a dance part, thinking that I was a special chosen one. I must’ve been so hard to work with, so I think your reaction to me was normal, Ishida-san. It made me realize how Suzuki Kanon-san (graduated in 2016), who took time to befriend me, is a very tolerant person of incredible character.

— When did this relationship begin to change?

Ishida: When I wasn’t able to hide in my actions that I wasn't fond of her. The other members picked up on it and started gossiping. (laughs) It got to the point where whenever we got paired up, they would heckle us and I’d shoot back with “this sucks!” It worked as entertainment hugely thanks to Harunan (Iikubo Haruna, graduated in 2018), Michishige-san, and our manager at the time.

Oda: The adults must’ve thought this was a dumb kids’ squabble. (laughs)

Ishida: It really became a bit when the staff forced us to go on a trip to a matchmaking shrine in Kyoto for content. I really didn’t want to do it. Oda, you probably didn’t want to go with someone who kept complaining too huh? (laughs)

Oda:  I was thinking “Ishida-san won’t be thrilled about this. How should I approach her?” (laughs)

Ishida: Thinking back, I’m sorry to Oda’s fans. It’s hurtful to have someone continually say they don’t like the girl you do like, and there have been instances where the jokes didn’t land and were just plain mean. I feel terrible about that.

Oda: Just saying our unfiltered thoughts out loud wasn’t necessarily funny. I remember the two of us had discussions on how we should interact with each other before doing so in front of others.

— These days we simply see you as great partners. Did anything specific trigger this big change?

Ishida: My gen mates graduating was a big one. The only person left with similar experiences and motivation levels as me was Oda, so I started sharing a lot of my thoughts on performance and stage with her.

Oda: It’d be things like “I’m thinking of using this topic in an MC, what do you think of the setup and flow?” We talked a lot about stuff related to public performance.

— Sounds like you’re great business partners!

Ishida: Yes, we are.

Oda: But I hope people don’t take that term negatively. (laughs) It doesn’t have to do with being close or not – it’s simply important to have people you work with who run at similar wavelengths and motivation levels.

Ishida: Agreed. There’s only so much one person can do.

Oda: Exactly. That’s why I think if either of us ever lost passion, that’d be the end of our relationship.

— What do you think your relationship is going to be like after graduation?

Ishida: Graduated members’ perspectives change once they get some distance from the group. They become kinder and say things like “oh, I’ve been there.” And I get why it happens, but that’s strictly not allowed between us. (laughs) Oda said to me, “Ishida-san, if you start talking to me like that, we’re over.”

Oda: (laughs) Of course! After everything we’d been through with our shared passion, I’d hate for you to start going “oh, I remember those days!” I’d never forgive you. Even after graduation, I need you to stay as connected to the frontlines as possible to keep your fire burning. (laughs) But from now on I’m sure there’s going to be many moments where I wonder, “what would Ishida-san think?” or “what would Ishida-san do?”

Ishida: Lately you’ve been making an effort to speak your mind, haven’t you?

Oda: I have. I really want to be even more precise and specific in communicating, but I can’t do it as well as you…

Ishida: Finding the best way to convey our thoughts is tricky.

Oda: Yes. There are some things people can’t change unless they make the realization themselves. I end up talking to you about it, Ishida-san, because you get how frustrating that can be to watch. Lately Makino (Maria) has been feeling the same, so we’ve been having a lot of these conversations together.

Ishida: If we were younger we wouldn’t be thinking or worrying this much. We’re also gaining experience you can only get from having done this for so long, though.

The Embodiment of Ambition – What You Respect About Each Other

— You’ve worked together for so long now. What’s something that you think is truly amazing about each other?

Oda: So many things! She’s been our best dancer for so long but never lets it get to her head and still practices the most. She even went back to dance school to better grasp the fundamentals. How she’s never complacent feels very Morning Musume to me. You’ve still been trying to improve your singing as well, right?

Ishida: Honestly it’s really frustrating! People have different tastes on dancing so how good someone is can be subjective. But if your singing is off-key, that’s taken as a clear mistake. For as long as I’m in Morning Musume, I have to keep that in mind and keep striving for better.

Oda: How you’ve pushed through 13 years with that mindset is really cool. You’re very simply a wonderful person, and so those who gather around you are great people too. I don’t think very many people are still this pure and passionate after being in entertainment for 13 years.

Ishida: At some point I made a conscious effort to improve as a person, so it makes me really happy when people acknowledge who I am now. But what makes me happiest is when people around me are complimented as well! Speaking of which, I get the sense our juniors naturally adore you. The way you get closer to people didn’t work with me (laughs) but a from a junior’s perspective, a senior willing to stick around and give advice freely must make them so happy. Oda, you don’t even seem to be doing it consciously.

Oda: Yeah, I just hang around because I enjoy watching them and have the time. (laughs)

Ishida: But that’s wonderful. After I announced my graduation, Oda immediately sensed the impending danger and told the others “we’re losing our best dancer!” (laughs) She also takes the lead in rehearsals to come over and ask me for help, saying stuff like “I can’t make this part look cool, can you teach me?”

Oda: I bug you the most out of everyone. (laughs)

Ishida: To be aware and conscious of that is very Morning Musume and makes me happy.

— You’ve both been supporting the group’s song and dance for many years. Which song do you think is the other’s best performance?

Oda: All of her performances are incredible but I think the true brilliance is in Ishida-san herself when she’s on stage. Even if others let out a similar energy in the moment, Ishida-san's enthusiasm and accumulated experience shrines through. The way she hypes up the crowd or even the unscripted moments when she’s just standing there are so captivating. It’s as they say: brilliance wasn’t built up in a day. [Note: this is the title of a Michishige Sayumi song, which itself is a play on the idiom “Rome wasn’t built in a day.”]

Ishida: What immediately came to mind is HOW DO YOU LIKE JAPAN? ~Nihon wa Donna Kanji Dekka?~. I took on the parts of rapping and hyping up the audience after Niigaki Risa-san graduated. Initially I was paired with Sayashi (Riho)-san, then Fukumura (Mizuki)-san, and since this year I’ve been with Oda. I’ve been with Fukumura-san on this song for so long I wondered if it would feel off, but I was just shocked by how incredible Oda’s singing is. (laughs) You can add inflections even in a hype song like this? In our first performance together I remember being wowed by how different and amazing it sounded. It was fascinating. She’s an incredibly reliable partner.

Oda: That makes me happy, thank you. But I worry about that song after your graduation, Ishida-san. What are we going to do without you?

Ishida: Exactly what I wanted to hear! That’s the kind of vigour I’ve been going into this tour with - until I graduate, I want to make everyone think that for every song I perform.

Still a Mystery After Over a Decade – Something You Don’t Understand About The Other

— Is there anything about each other that you think is still a mystery after all this time?

Ishida: It's a fine line between amazing and not, but Oda is incredibly knowledgeable about a lot of things. I always wonder “where did you learn that and when would you ever need to use it?” But your wide breadth of knowledge is exactly why you're able to have engaging conversations with anyone and everyone.

Oda: From my end, something that’s really mysterious about Ishida-san is how she seems to care a lot about appearances, yet she’ll come to the concert venue looking like she just woke up. In the winter she’ll be wearing a nice jacket with some ancient tracksuit underneath. So you don’t care about those moments!? (laughs)

Ishida: I only care about the surface level things because I’m lazy. (laughs)

Oda: I’ve got one more: she’ll tell the members we shouldn’t use smartphone cases that could give away our identity, but turn around and use a transparent one with a sticker of her name and a polaroid she took with (Yamazaki) Mei-chan tucked in between. The polaroid even says “To Ishida-san” on it.

Ishida: Maybe someone seeing that will think the phone belongs to a fan of mine? (laughs)

Oda: Your fans wouldn’t have a polaroid that says “To Ishida-san” on it. I can concede on the sticker, but please at least use a nameless polaroid!

Ishida: Ehh…. Maybe I should put a picture of you to avoid detection then? (laughs)

Oda: That would be shocking in its own way. (laughs)

And of course, everyone's favourite: the freestyle dance segment in Morning Curry 🍛🥄

It all started during rehearsals when I was messing around and did something like an Indian dance (?) while the instructor was working with the other members. Oda said, "You should totally do it on stage at our fourth concert over the weekend~ It would really cheer me up~"

I started goofing off during our second night in Osaka, then began to switch it up every concert beginning with the Nagano daytime show. By the same night, everyone was already adapting to my antics (wow!) And at the night in Gunma, the silly faces we made suddenly started getting shown on the big monitors too.

This secret little joke we started without even the dance instructors knowing grew into one of the biggest highlights of our show, lol. I really had so much fun and looked forward to everyone's reactions every time.

I probably would've done it even if Oda hadn't suggested to, but… "Am I overdoing it?" "Should I try this?" "Would this be funny?" Etc, etc - I always checked in with Oda first (and not just about this curry bit). She gave me so much feedback, positive or negative, and was the person I turned to before sharing any ideas with others. So many times she gave me the encouragement to go ahead, or held me back when I needed it.

Now she's cut off all ties with me, what do I do 😕😕 Starting our relationship from scratch will take me another 10 years to get here. Is that okay? 😕😕

We still have a long road ahead so I guess that's okay. Thanks, let's keep going, and do your best!

【Morning Musume '24 Concert Tour Fall WE CAN DANCE ~Blå Eld~ Ishida Ayumi Final】

#OdaSakura #🌸 #IshidaAyumi

Note: The cutting ties thing is a response to what Oda said to Ishida at her graduation concert